Character Creation Cast

Series 48.3 - Kids on Brooms with Jonathan Gilmour and Doug Levandowski [Designers] (Discussion)

Episode Summary

Welcome to the final episode of series 48, everyone! This series, we welcome Jonathan Gilmour and Doug Levandowski, to learn about their game, Kids on Brooms, the latest in the Kids on series that started with Kids on Bikes where you play as students at a magic school! This episode we discuss the character creation process, get into some great fanfic, and go way too long in our announcements and outtakes!

Episode Notes

Welcome to the final episode of series 48, everyone! This series, we welcome Jonathan Gilmour and Doug Levandowski, to learn about their game, Kids on Brooms, the latest in the Kids on series that started with Kids on Bikes where you play as students at a magic school! This episode we discuss the character creation process, get into some great fanfic, and go way too long in our announcements and outtakes!


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Guests and Projects:

Jonathan Gilmour @JonGilmour

Doug Levandowski @DougLevandowski

Games discussed this episode:

Kids on Brooms




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Character Creation Cast:

Amelia Antrim:

Ryan Boelter:

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Episode Transcription

Transcripts Automatically Generated - Not 100% Accurate

Amelia Antrim  0:01  

Welcome to the final episode of Series 48. Everyone, this is a fun, I've been having a lot of fun with this series. So I'm really excited for people to hear some of the discussion that we had because these designer episodes are always just like Chef kiss. So good. But before all of that before we can let people hear the great quality content,


Unknown Speaker  0:22  

announcements, announcements


Amelia Antrim  0:26  

for that to know.


Ryan Boelter  0:30  

So there is a bundle that you should check out on a chai Oh, it is in the final stretches of its time on a try. Oh,


Amelia Antrim  0:38  

I guess it's run. I believe this


Ryan Boelter  0:44  

campaign. I don't know it's been there. It started off the month at a couple days on there. And it's running to the end as of the release of this episode. So this is the TTRPG bundle for trans rights Texas. There are almost 500 items included in this bundle, including my very own game, our final gathering the dreaded reflection to the immortal soul, which is a mouthful. But it's a fun game. We covered that on our Patreon exclusive episode if you want to hear what it's about. But this bundle is only $5. Minimum. It's meant to provide funds to trans advocacy groups in Texas in light of recent policies enacted by the governor, which, among other things, seeks to prosecute parents who provide gender affirming health care to their kids as child abusers. And that is super gross. So


Amelia Antrim  1:33  

yeah, it's not science. No, yeah, absolutely. Not science. Right.


Ryan Boelter  1:41  

So this legislation, legislation is both dangerous, directly to the families affected, but also indirectly, as it sets a really bad precedence for other states to do similar things. And that kind of sucks. So this bundle helps advocates work with families directly impacted and to fight against these dangerous and discriminatory policies.


Amelia Antrim  2:05  

We encourage you to give to that cause first, because it they need it. If you have something left over and you're looking for something to do with that money, our network does have a Patreon that helps our show and all the other shows on the network. It is at Shot podcast, it does get you bonus episodes for the various shows on the network at the $5 and up level. And other levels above that I think the 15 a month level, you get a free RPG every month. We have a new bonus episode coming up where I create characters with my kids for a game called Weird scouts that focuses on kids playing magical scouts in a like a magical forest setting. Yeah, it's very cute. It's a lot of fun. We had a great time recording Nate was peak Nate. And it's fun because we did that one a few years ago. And so it's interesting to hear how much they've grown up since we last episode one to it. The audio quality is not great. I was using my old microphone and it did betray me a little bit but Ryan being the editing genius that he has mostly fixed it up. So it's not up to our usual standards. But it is also three of us in a closet around a microphone. So yeah, what can you what can you do?


Ryan Boelter  3:28  

What can you do? Absolutely. Another cool thing that we've got going on right now is we just finished designs for some T shirts that we're going to be adding to the One Shot network T public store sometime soon. It's not only T shirts, you can get stickers, mugs, posters,


Amelia Antrim  3:46  

posters, flags to hang on


Ryan Boelter  3:48  

to get leave into Canvas prints as well. It's wild how many things you can do on that.


Amelia Antrim  3:54  

But in cases I think depending on there's some


Ryan Boelter  3:56  

funky Yeah. So Amelia has been having a lot of fun making designs and we've been having quite a good laugh about some of our favourite inside jokes that we've got going on. Yep.


Amelia Antrim  4:07  

Yeah, I mean there's a couple from episodes but a lot of it is like inside jokes right now. So


Ryan Boelter  4:12  

absolutely. I've been we've been posting some previews on our Discord. So if you want to check those out, you can go to discord dot character creation and join us and comment and maybe shape the future of T shirts


Amelia Antrim  4:25  

to tell people like what the what the first design is? Yeah, it was the first on the show here. I invented a logo for our sims four Esports League. So if you go to our episodes about micro games, it is episode three of that series. I don't remember the series number 28 Or No.


Ryan Boelter  4:46  

or 30 something I don't know. RPG is with us.


Amelia Antrim  4:50  

Yes maker RPG is but we created a Sims for Esports League. And so I did it did make a shirt for that league.


Ryan Boelter  4:58  

It looks very official.


Amelia Antrim  4:59  

It does I'm really excited about it to have some swear eSports. But I've been working on a couple other ones that are a little more like, show centric, and then some that are from specific series. So I'm excited to get them out into the world. I've been having fun playing with designs. So


Ryan Boelter  5:19  

yeah, we'll put a link in the show notes to the network store. So you can keep an eye out for the new design. So it's going to take a little while because folks on the network are busy, just like almost everybody else in life. Yep. So they'll get there when they get there.


Amelia Antrim  5:33  

Yeah, hopefully around the end of the month sometime. But we're excited. I'm going to buy one right away. Absolutely. Nate has already asked for one too. So I noted last time that I really want to make some playlists for some of our series I recently posted on Twitter and Instagram and our Discord also, about the one I made for our Christmas belonging series. It is late for Christmas, and it is still kind of winter ish. It was snowing here yesterday a little bit. There actually aren't any Christmas songs on there, though. So it's mostly kind of winter feels. Yeah. We asked recently on Twitter. But we would also like to hear from people, what you would like a playlist for and what kind of themes and vibes you think we should put in there. And also, if there are any songs that you think absolutely need to be in there. Yeah. I also just thought of another thing that I was gonna say in these announcements. We would like to do another q&a mailbag episode at some point. We did one for our one year anniversary, we are creeping up on our four year anniversary. So we would really like to do another one, we will put a Google form out on Twitter and our Discord and other places. We'll put a link to one in the show notes, too. Yeah. But if you have questions that you'd like to ask us, and you'd like us to answer, we would like to do a fun little bonus episode at some point.


Ryan Boelter  7:01  

Absolutely. Oh, man, I think well, we'll probably release that as part of our series 50 celebration extravaganza, which is coming up in May. Yeah. So so really get us get us your questions. And goodness gracious, we will answer them. The best of our ability can be questions about us question about games question about Character Creation, Cast questions about world building questions about memes, whatever, yes.


Amelia Antrim  7:29  

On the show, or want to hear on the show or any of that. We would love to Absolutely.


Ryan Boelter  7:35  

Ask, ask us anything. And if it's appropriate, we will answer that question. Yeah. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  7:43  

Wonderful. You know anything about four years making a podcast four years later, somehow still? We did say in the very beginning that we're like, we have hundreds of ideas and things that could go on forever. So like, we're only at 50.


Ryan Boelter  7:55  

Yeah, yeah. And we got ways to go. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  7:58  

we got we got time.


Ryan Boelter  8:02  

Speaking of time, we have a tick tock page.


Amelia Antrim  8:07  

I love that. good segue. Nice.


Ryan Boelter  8:11  

We are currently only hosting our teasers for upcoming episodes. We're not sure if we're gonna use it for anything else. We might we may not we have no idea. We're still figuring out what we know. And what we think we know. We're still learning about internet. Yeah, we're still learning about internet stuff like Tic TOCs and the ticky tacky is so you can follow us at Character Creation, Cast all one word on tic tac. And like our stuff, and and share it, I guess I don't know how tick tock works. But whatever, whatever you can do to throw the algorithm out there for other folks to see our stuff. That'd be awesome.


Amelia Antrim  8:47  

Yeah, I'm going back and listening to older episodes, too. So I'm hoping that we'll put some, like, not teasers at this point. But like little clips from older episodes to in there.


Ryan Boelter  8:56  

Yeah, absolutely. I've been really enjoying putting together the teasers for upcoming episodes. And it's it's a really easy process for me at this point. So we'll probably just pull like snippets of audio here and there and throw them up on Twitter and Tik Tok and, and just kind of give a little taste of some of our older stuff. So if you if you've been reluctant to listen to some of these series, just because it's not a game that you were enjoying, you can get a nice little snippet of some of the the wisdom or hilarity that ensues within the episodes. Because there's a lot of gems that are hidden throughout all of our series. That's not just about the game that we're covering. So say like, there


Amelia Antrim  9:39  

are times where, you know, we we sit down to do a game because we're like, you know, it's the it's coming up or you know, it's something that we think that our listeners would really enjoy or something but like it's not always my jam. Because you know, not everything's for everyone. And sometimes we'll sit down to do these games and by the end of a series I'm like, Oh, actually, well All right, why did I not like this guy? Like, why was I not into this? So, you know, obviously, not everybody has to listen to everything. And it's the thing that I love about our show was really easy to kind of come in and out, too. But definitely the teasers I think helped give people a little idea of, you know, maybe this will be fun, even if it's not my kind of game. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  10:21  

And if we're going to do more than that on tick tock, more than more than just the teasers. We'll let you know. But also feel free to suggest stuff at us and


Amelia Antrim  10:31  

tell us what people do on tick tock, I don't dive too deep into it, because I just like I, I just don't trust my ADHD, like, I will get sucked in. So I don't, you know, it's not like for me, it's not like a level of like, I don't understand how to, it's just like, I don't, I don't want to Yeah, so you know, if there's things that I should know, like, you tell me tell me the memes


Ryan Boelter  10:52  

10 hours later,


Amelia Antrim  10:54  

right? Well, that's like, I don't, I don't want to do that. I tell my sister to just send me once that she thinks I would like and that's what she does. So that's where I get my get my tick tock from. There you go. Secondhand tick tock. Okay, final announcement, I swear. If you didn't check out our bonus character creation spotlight episode from last week for us, he was Bed and Breakfast. We got into some really fantastic discussion. We learned about that phenomenal game, which is crowdfunding right now. It is it's, it really hit on some fun topics about character creation, and about what we consider to be RPG is what we count as role playing. It got really in depth for one of our Spotlight Series.


Ryan Boelter  11:36  

I love that we got into the weeds of some really fantastic conversation.


Amelia Antrim  11:42  

Like I've always wanted to ask people and talk about and like just doesn't come up where we haven't really had room for and this was the perfect game to really dig my dig my hands in the dirt of some of those. Yeah, so I know I went way off script on that one, but it's a great discussion.


Ryan Boelter  11:57  

Yeah. And Jay and Lily were fantastic guests. And if you haven't listened absolutely go check it out. Because as an episode by itself, it's it's just fantastic. So I hope you enjoy if you haven't heard it, and if you had I hope you had enjoyed it.


Amelia Antrim  12:13  

Yeah, it is crowdfunding right now on Indiegogo. Just to like point that out, not on Kickstarter. It's on Indiegogo. So we'll have a link in the show notes. And please check it out. It's a really cool concept for a game doing things that a lot of games are not doing right now. But in a really fun, interesting, very accessible way.


Ryan Boelter  12:33  

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I promise that's it. We are the announcements today. You know, stick around after the show for the call to action, as well as our ever growing outtakes. In the meantime, enjoy the show.


Amelia Antrim  13:49  

Welcome back to our discussion episode. Last time we finished our session zero for kids on brooms. This episode we are discussing the character creation process. We are thrilled to welcome back Doug Levandowski. And Jonathan Gilmore. Would you like to reintroduce yourselves to everyone and tell us a little bit about the characters you made with us?


Doug Levandowski  14:10  

Sure thing. I'm Doug Ducey. I'm excited to still be here. Be back to being here. Continue my being here. I made Garrison gar Wilbur thrum. The fourth was a hottie descendant junior at poof, and prestigious quarter of fantastisk ism.


Amelia Antrim  14:37  

Ryan forgot we named


Doug Levandowski  14:41  

it our very serious game jammed by Greg. And yeah, a guy who's willing to help mermaids if they're cute enough.


Ryan Boelter  14:53  

That's what he says.


Doug Levandowski  14:53  

That's what he says.


Jonathan Gilmour  14:55  

Sounds problematic. gory.


Ryan Boelter  14:57  

He's got a heart under there. I don't even know You may not know, gar is


Doug Levandowski  15:03  

this gorgeous scumbag? Oh, no, I would not have made that character if I was actually going to play. Yes. My rule is I don't play evil characters.


Ryan Boelter  15:14  

So yeah. Oh, boy, you know, we got fanfiction coming up so so we'll see kind of how that may go if we actually did,


Amelia Antrim  15:23  

like a nice redemption mark, you know, maybe there's room for maybe there's room for love. Okay? Okay, sure.


Ryan Boelter  15:34  

All right, Jonathan, how about yourself? Yeah, I'm


Jonathan Gilmour  15:36  

Jonathan John Mueller. I'm a game designer and I created Jimmy tingle bottom. It was funny, but he is cursed with a curse that only makes his luck working at streams. So either very, very good or very, very bad things happen never middle the road. And there's a lot of hidden conflicts with the other players. In the reason one of the other players is cursed as well. And I want to mention all the horrible things in my school bag because we didn't really talk about that. Oh, yeah, so my my school bag is full of marbles. Bananas, bottles of oil that I use to oil my unicycle that I ride all the time. Why? Generally wines?


Amelia Antrim  16:27  

Do you have any turtle shells in there? Too late? Oh,


Jonathan Gilmour  16:29  

turtle shells. Okay. A Yo yo, asleep shot and a fishy ball? That is a magical artifact.


Ryan Boelter  16:40  

an orb of protectionist. Yes. Yeah. It's amazing. Yes. All


Jonathan Gilmour  16:45  

these things in my school bag constantly cause very bad situations or very Fallout


Amelia Antrim  16:54  

all the time. No,


Jonathan Gilmour  16:56  

no, no, I gotta have my marbles.


Amelia Antrim  16:58  

Yeah, like you to a battle. Right? You never know when it's gonna come up. Ryan, can you tell us about your character?


Ryan Boelter  17:10  

Yeah. So I created Elvira whisper shakes. She's the haunted survivor. She was part of a magical girl troupe that was they had an encounter, unfortunately, with the brunt of a virus curse that eventually disappeared the rest of the group leaving only the Elvira behind. And and shortly after, then her curse got intertwined with with Amy Catherine's character, Amy, Catherine. And goodness, Ben kind of best friends. Probably before the curse, I'm guessing.


Amelia Antrim  17:55  

Yeah. I think and


Ryan Boelter  17:56  

then. And then kind of we all went to this school together to try to get a better handle on at least my powers. And I think maybe. I think Amy Katherine just came along as well. Yeah, so it's goodness. It. There's a lot there. There's a lot going on there. Oh, and she she's constantly fighting off, like life or death forces that only herself and Amy. Katherine can can see. Yes. So it just looks like she's kind of dancing in the middle of nowhere. Off and on. Just a small little quirk of knowing Elvira.


Amelia Antrim  18:43  

life or death situation is just a small Quirk.


Ryan Boelter  18:45  

It's fine.


Amelia Antrim  18:47  

It's just a cute fun thing that she does.


Ryan Boelter  18:50  

She's adorable. She flips over people randomly. How about yourself, Amelia?


Amelia Antrim  18:56  

Well, I made Amy Katherine Boyd. The reliable bestie. Amy Katherine is perpetually second place to have IRA. She has the same curse, and kind of followed a Vyra to this school thinking, you know, she's already lost so many people. She can't lose anybody else. I should definitely go with her. It's probably not because I'm in love with her. I don't know what you're talking about. Maybe a little bit it is. And now she's sort of battling and grappling with the fact that like, she thinks she probably is smart enough to figure out how to break this curse. But everybody is so focused on Elvira and her need to like save her magical girl team that nobody's really nobody really cares what Amy Catherine has to say about the whole thing. So


Ryan Boelter  19:52  

except for Elvira Maybe, and maybe guard a little bit


Amelia Antrim  19:56  

regard a little bit. Yeah. So Yeah, just kind of trying to like maybe be first place once in a while. Yeah, but not at whatever. The game that we made up is I forgot what we called


Ryan Boelter  20:12  

it yeah oh yes.


Amelia Antrim  20:16  

Because we are perpetually in second place. Maybe that is the place where Amy Katherine can finally shine.


Ryan Boelter  20:21  

I know it's the is the premier volleyball cooking show competition of the wizarding world. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  20:30  

Never won. No. Maybe I've come so close friend can like bring them to the championship.


Ryan Boelter  20:36  

I know. Seriously.


Amelia Antrim  20:38  

Finally be finally be on top.


Ryan Boelter  20:41  

Oh, and that's not even to mention our principal. Meredith bleep blurp. If you have not listened to the character creation episodes, what are you doing? But yeah, we okay. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  21:00  

yes. Like last hurt Solon had it place,


Ryan Boelter  21:05  

potentially. So Meredith soul got put into the automaton and then potentially got replaced with an imposter. Right. That's a rumor. That's, that's true.


Amelia Antrim  21:18  

And we haven't even touched on the whole litigation situation with the merpeople. Oh, yeah,


Ryan Boelter  21:24  

we're in the sequel, the island that the school is on gotten dropped into the middle of Lake Erie,


Amelia Antrim  21:29  

we were only recording for sure we did so much. We, we wrought so much havoc in two short hours.


Doug Levandowski  21:41  

Kids rooms packs, it is such a smaller timeframe.


Ryan Boelter  21:46  

That's very true.


Amelia Antrim  21:47  

What horror?


Ryan Boelter  21:50  

Well, let's go ahead and dive right into a segment that we are calling D 24. Your thoughts?


Amelia Antrim  21:55  

D 24. Your thoughts? So in this segment, we talk to our guests about their thoughts on the character creation process as it relates to this system as it relates to other games. And we also like to get to know you as people. So we always start with the most cliche question in roleplaying podcasts. Oh, did you start in RPGs? Genuine, sir.


Jonathan Gilmour  22:20  

Sure. So um, you know, I grew up in a really, really small town and couldn't find anybody to play d&d with. So I just read d&d books. And then once I moved to Ohio, and started making some more gaming friends, I got into a d&d group, which I think we met for about a year maybe, and then it kind of fell apart because of scheduling conflicts.


Amelia Antrim  22:47  

As it does, yeah. And tradition,


Jonathan Gilmour  22:52  

as is the curse and blessing of play. And then I kind of discovered, I always really struggled with being a GM because I felt like I did create everything ahead of time. And never felt like I could run a game if I didn't know every little thing. So then I discovered, you know, Apocalypse powered systems and like the zero prep GME and kind of re fell in love with role playing games.


Ryan Boelter  23:17  

Yeah, those games have been such a blessing.


Jonathan Gilmour  23:22  

Yeah, huge inspiration. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  23:24  

yeah. Yeah. Much lower barrier to entry. I think for a lot of people to to prep for that. Because I always feel the same way. When I go to like, run a game. It's like, I got to know everything all the time. And then like having games where it's like, no, you don't, you can't like Oh, yeah.


Ryan Boelter  23:42  

Compared to heroes unlimited. Where to make a villain, you literally have to make a full character.


Jonathan Gilmour  23:48  

Wow. Yeah. Like, I thought I had to have like the entire map of the town made and like, I didn't know that I could just like fill stuff in and leave lights. And that was such a big revelation to me. Like if they say, is there a blacksmith in town? I just say yes. It's over here and then draw it on the map. Yeah, right. Absolutely.


Doug Levandowski  24:06  

I got started playing second edition d&d in 6/6 grade, seventh grade, with some people from my Boy Scout troop, which is maybe the most cliched way to get into role playing games.


Jonathan Gilmour  24:23  

I learned Magic the Gathering was Boy Scouts. Yeah.


Doug Levandowski  24:27  

Yeah. And played that for a little while. I was really, really, really into it, and then stopped playing for a while and then sort of gradually fell back into it. As I started to get back into board games in in my 30s and have never looked back.


Amelia Antrim  24:52  

What made both of you make that jump from a player I'm a GM to I need to make my own game, you know, like a lot of us kind of like homebrew things and sort of like, you know, it's a slippery slope. But I know for some people, it's like, there's a moment of like, I need this game to exist. Yeah,


Doug Levandowski  25:12  

I was home brewing stuff, you know, back in seventh grade. Yeah. And they were bad, right? They were unplayable. But But I thought they were awesome.


Amelia Antrim  25:24  

I don't think anything I did in like, seventh or eighth grade, I look back. I'm like, that was peak content.


Doug Levandowski  25:31  

Well, what about my novel? But yeah, and then the jump sort of started happening with, I was designing board games and stuff. And realized that I was just way more interested in the narrative side of things than I was in the, you know, the sort of, like, mechanical design side of things. Yeah, I like mechanics. But the, the story always interested me way more in getting people to tell an interesting story. Somebody was trying to do with board games and realize it's just better to do it with


Amelia Antrim  26:08  

Yeah, role playing games. Yeah, there's a lot more room for that narrative. And it's just, it's open you. What about you, John, did you have like a moment? Or was it the same kind of slow, slow decline?


Jonathan Gilmour  26:22  

Um, it was kind of a slow decline. So in high school, I also, you know, I couldn't find people to play RPGs with so I was like, I'm just gonna make my own RPG. And I spent like, a year writing like a Final Fantasy seven. RPG that was just utter garbage. Oh,


Amelia Antrim  26:40  

I wonder how many of those there are out there cuz I feel like you're not the first person to say that it was Final Fantasy seven. That was like the game that they were. I wonder how many how many people have Final Fantasy seven


Jonathan Gilmour  26:54  

years I grew up playing like video role playing games. So I was like, pen and paper. And then yeah, trying to similarly died. Like I've been designing board games for a long time and data winner, which is my more most popular one. Really borrowed a lot of my love of RPG is in it with like, the narratively driven and a lot of players making decisions based on like their own morality and their characters rather than mechanics. So I, you know, I really love that and I had dabbled, I actually have an RPG that I've never really cited designed before kids on bikes that I should revisit at some point. But then when the opportunity came up to do this with Doug, like, I jumped at it.


Ryan Boelter  27:43  

Yeah, absolutely.


Amelia Antrim  27:45  

Yeah, I think that was the same, the same, like kind of origin story that Ryan has was just like, oh, I played RPG video games. And then it was like, Oh, also, you can do them, not video?


Ryan Boelter  27:57  

Absolutely. So what do you look for in a system? As far as character creation goes, like, what sort of pieces need to be there for great characters to happen?


Doug Levandowski  28:06  

For great characters to happen? I think there have to be things that surprise the player about their character. You know, like some of the questions were like, not to flex too hard on this, but I think we do a pretty good job with character creation in here. Right? That? Yeah, having some of those questions pop in there, where you're like, oh, I don't know if my Oh, yeah, my character would do that.


Amelia Antrim  28:33  

Yeah, there were a couple moments as you're going through those questions that you were like, well, you know, like, what have you stolen from Sutton? I was like, Well, I wouldn't. Well, I guess in this situation, I might. Yeah, the things that like really made me kind of question like, What, what, under what circumstances would I do those things?


Ryan Boelter  28:53  

Yeah. Especially the one about me trying to get your character spelled?


Amelia Antrim  28:58  

Yes. Yeah, that one. I was like, Would you like I was waiting for you to say like reroll it. I won't go with this. And you were like, no, actually, I


Ryan Boelter  29:06  

lean into this,


Amelia Antrim  29:07  

right? It's yeah.


Doug Levandowski  29:09  

Right. Because we're, we're generally inclined to play some idealized version of ourselves in role playing games, for sure. And using character creation to break us out of that, either to make them not idealized, or to make them so different from ourselves. You know, it's sort of like learning by play about the character. I think that's one of the big things for me and, and simplicity, right that one of my goals in role playing games that have learned so much from John about is, like just getting the mechanics to get out of the way of the plane. And the more you can do that, I think the more you let people lean into the mimicry aspect of it, where you're embodying this other character. Mm


Jonathan Gilmour  29:57  

hmm. Yeah, and I think you know, I I agree and like it really needs to be about those like personal connections like I think I used to do in like Shadowrun or d&d is like I would write down secrets for every character that connected them to another character every game, because the more you preload that, you know, I really liked it. And then, you know, powered by Apocalypse kind of has like the character creation questions on the character sheet. And we just wanted to really build on that and try to make it like this robust thing of its own. That isn't necessarily, like you do have the trope questions. You know, that didn't go with your specific thing, but like having those really general questions and just add so many twists before you even play like to you. You feel like you're jumping in media Rez into this living world rather than like, you find yourself in a tavern. Right? You all know each other.


Amelia Antrim  30:53  

Right? Yeah, yeah, for sure. Yeah, I like games that kind of ask those sort of questions and force you to think about those, I know that my my favorite role playing game for a long time still like a little bit as a warm place in my heart was the fourth edition of The Legend of the five rings game, which has the game of 20 questions in there. And I after you make your character you go through, and there's 20 questions. And the last one is how will your character die? And wow, I just really always liked answering that question of like, okay, how, how do I envision this? Going? Like, you know, it may not go that way in a game, but like, now that I have picked out all of these flaws, and, you know, done all these other things, like, what, what is the combination of those things. And just like as an interesting thought, exercise was always really fun for me. And I like, the way that more and more games are translating some of that into character creation, and then adding it between characters to have like, let's, okay, let's assume this is complicated and bad stuffs going to happen. Now what?


Ryan Boelter  31:58  

Yep. Yeah, and I do love the those relationship questions. When when games include those because they, they add such a nice dynamic that you don't get from, you know, a quote, unquote, more traditional game where you're just creating your characters in a bubble. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  32:19  

And I think they give GM so much more to work with, because now we've just like, put all of these things on the table, and there's all these extra strings to pull on. And we've also spent a lot of time laying out, these are the things that I want to play with, like these are are the concepts that I want to engage with. And I have handed them to you on a platter and said, Here, go for it. You know, there's so much more there than just like, I am strong, I am smart. I have two axes. There's just a lot more there.


Doug Levandowski  32:51  

Yet, in the design process credit where credit is due, our friend Jay tree was great at like pushing us to get better and better and better questions in there. So major credit to Jay.


Amelia Antrim  33:04  

Yes. Like, they're fantastic questions. Really good.


Ryan Boelter  33:08  

I had I had an experience recently, I have never played any of the kids on systems in the past. And I recently started up a game with somebody, we're playing a different game, somebody from a very dark and gritty fantasy setting. But it doesn't have any of that like relationship building stuff. So the GM pulled in the questions, the relationship questions and the world building questions from kids on bikes. Oh, cool. And utilize that to build a relationship web. And once that relationship web was set, goodness, we had this like, really rich interactions between all characters that was a would have been missing. Otherwise, we would have had to find all of that out in play. And, and I guarantee it would not have come up that same way.


Amelia Antrim  34:04  

No, and I have to say, as somebody who's the eternal player, and like the never GM, because I don't, I don't like running games. I feel a lot more confident going into a game, having done these kinds of relationship questions, because I already have a basis of what these interactions should be like and what kind of relationships I'm trying to roleplay I already know going into this game, that Ryan is going to be my best friend. And then gar and I are going to have like this weird thing happening. And you know, like so I'm already comfortable that like when there's downtime or sort of a lull in like, you know, the mechanical things happening. I can lean into that without feeling awkward. Like I already know that we've set this up, and we're all okay with it, and we're good. And it doesn't feel that way. And a lot of games, a lot of games. It's like okay, well I don't really know you and you don't really know me So I guess we'll just stand here and I don't like or awkwardly suddenly pretend we're best friends. And if known each other for months, you know, I just feel a lot more prepared, going into a game when it has stuff like that.


Ryan Boelter  35:13  

Leading questions are so good. Absolutely. It almost sounds like we've been answering the next question even. Yeah,


Jonathan Gilmour  35:22  

a little bit here.


Amelia Antrim  35:23  

Um, yeah. So our next question is, how do you think that character creation in the system stacks up against other games? In particular, I was like to ask like, are there things that you felt like you had to have to make this a good, like character creation process when you were writing a game like this needs to be here or things that you were like, we were definitely not doing that. Like we're not, you know, like rolling 3d Six. No, Sacco?


Doug Levandowski  35:51  

Yeah. I think one of the things that we were big on when we were working on this was trying to streamline things, right that yeah, not overwhelming people with choice. That limiting your options can actually, I think, breed creativity for people. Right, we were definitely working on with this. As far as like, how it stacks up against other systems that I like it. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  36:23  

Like I tell people on the show, that's it, like, go for it, like you made this game, you put it out into the world, like have the courage of your conviction? I don't think you would have put it out if it wasn't a good game. It's a good game.


Doug Levandowski  36:34  

Right. And we've done some revisions, you know, to stuff over time. You know, there was one question in the original kids on bikes that was a little bit problematic. And, you know, I sort of wish we'd edited that out. But, you know, as we've gotten, we've, I think, fine tune the, the creation process and all that sort of stuff. So I'm really happy with it. And I think if there were anything that we said, oh, it'd be cool, if we could, we would add it. Right,


Amelia Antrim  37:01  

right. And I think there's something to be said for, like the fact that the longer you will look at something, the easier it is to find things that you would have fixed or change, or you know, Ryan and I just after four years re recorded episode zero of this podcast, because we listened back to it. And we were like, This is a nightmare. And if this is the first thing people are like, this is I'm embarrassed. So you know, it's one of those you learned things over time. And what you put out five years ago isn't necessarily reflective of who you are now. And if you stare at something too long, you can find.


Jonathan Gilmour  37:36  

Yeah, I tend to get blind to things when I stare at them too long, but I try have a hard time seeing the light, the nuances, but like getting a bunch of people playing it, like revealed a ton of stuff, too. And yeah, helped us spot things that were missing. Like, our friend Ian pointed out that kids on bikes did not have bike creation rules in it or any bikes at all. Oh, no. That makes a lot of sense. We should try put those in. So he really says a free content. Friday thing? Yeah. Yeah, but I mean, I mean, go the other direction is done like it. To me, it stands up to other systems, because it's exactly the system I wanted. But he does every single thing I wanted RPG like character in world creation. Yeah. So I'm really happy with what it does, because it checks all my boxes.


Ryan Boelter  38:28  

Yeah, yeah, I love the the systems that include the the world creation as part of the session zero with the groups, I always say this collaborative world building is the the golden bullet of getting people invested in the game. Like if you're collaborating together to piece together, the setting that you're going to be playing in, you're everybody at the table has buy in


Amelia Antrim  38:56  

finding ways to do that even in a game that has an established setting because I know even when to run alpha bar conventions, too. We do things to like make that world our so we build our own clan, we build our own island, like Yeah, things that can kind of bring everybody in and make them invest invested in this thing that we have created together. And so now it is ours. And it's not just me showing up to hand you something. It's a very different experience.


Ryan Boelter  39:24  

Yeah, it really it really pulls you in and having that as part of character creation here and then having like the amount of potential with the relationship questions about how you can, like it's a it's a de 20 of questions where it's positive and negative. And I don't know if my character really knows your other character questions and that there's so much possibility of creating like we proved, we made a nice tangled web of relationships. Yeah, and It really fleshed out. Not only our group and our connections, but also the world at the same time. I,


Amelia Antrim  40:07  

I like these kind of games, because I think this one, and then we did, who was the other one that we did the spotlight episode on, but they both had like these, creating the rumors. And then you know, just like the one or two little pieces about the school, you know, it's like, we made up a sport, and some landmarks, and you know, it's like things that are not super intensive. When you think of like world building, like, let's create a political system in it, you know, and I was like, What is this weird sport that we all play? Yeah, and how much that can kind of influence the tone of the game. And, you know, again, it's another string to pull on later thing that can come up. It's so much fun. I love I love the the world building together.


Jonathan Gilmour  40:46  

And I'm always consistently surprised, like, when I run or play it, like, the same exact question can come up and have completely different results.


Amelia Antrim  40:54  

Yes, every time, like, totally different.


Jonathan Gilmour  40:59  

Like, we put it in there that you didn't just skip a question if it comes up again, but like, a lot of times they don't and they'll just come up with an answer that blows me away.


Amelia Antrim  41:07  

Yeah. Yeah. And well, and playing with like, a different group of people every time and getting, you know, like a totally different answers to those, like rumors and, and things like that. Just it's always phenomenal to me to see the amount of creativity that people have and bring to these kinds of things. And the stuff that people come up with, like, off the cuff, like always just blows my mind. Yes. Where did that come from?


Ryan Boelter  41:33  

Yeah. And that's another thing I love about the collaboration process is, you know, I don't think we would have gotten into volleyball plus cooking competition.


Amelia Antrim  41:41  

You know,


Ryan Boelter  41:42  

if it wasn't for, like, Well, I was thinking volleyball. Well, what do we mix that with? And you're like, Well, I was gonna say cooking competition, right? Yeah, of course, it has to be that. Right?


Amelia Antrim  41:52  

I understand how that works.


Jonathan Gilmour  41:55  

You don't have to know how it works. So that's the great thing. Right? Quidditch doesn't make any sense at all. So no reason ours should.


Amelia Antrim  42:04  

Right? Exactly.


Ryan Boelter  42:06  

You mean, the rest of this game? Doesn't matter. It's just that one little thing that you have to get.


Jonathan Gilmour  42:11  

Ready, set, sir. But the most important thing is your final plating.


Ryan Boelter  42:14  

Yeah, right. Exactly. Right.


Jonathan Gilmour  42:17  

Yeah. And I feel like some GMs should just write a book instead of running games. Yep. Because like I've played in games, where like, the GM has such a strict idea for their thing. Like, it's so real roadie, and yeah. You know, when you start playing with like that, you know, everyone building the world together it just trying to take that element out.


Amelia Antrim  42:38  

Yeah, yeah, definitely pull some of that ownership and like puts it in front of the group instead of being one person's game.


Ryan Boelter  42:46  

Yeah. All right. How does the process of character creation in this game reinforce the field and set expectations for play?


Doug Levandowski  42:55  

Yeah. And that's something we've worked really hard on, take that. The you know, the idea is that when you get into the game, we're doing the same thing we were just doing there. Right. The only difference is that sometimes we fail. Right? And that the conflict is more in the moment, rather than, you know, big sort of overview. Yeah, but yeah, the, we want the character creation, the world building, and all of this to be so player centered, that it's the GM asking questions, and the players filling it in, not, you know, like John said, not like, you're a character in my novel, you get to roll the dice to determine whether your character does this or doesn't. But I'm telling the story here, you know, this is John and I were working on something the other day and said, like, boy will really be in trouble if like, our players figure out they could just take an improv class, right, like, like, that's, that's the vibe, we're going for it that, and the, the character creation and world building sets that


Amelia Antrim  43:58  

up? Yeah, I would agree. That sounds like what you know, because what I can tell from having built characters is that it's going to be a pretty narrative, heavy, relatively streamlined process to go through that it's gonna be focused on the story that we're telling and then, you know, some dice here and there to kind of answer the question of what happens when I do the thing. But that it's it's not, you know, it's not combat heavy. It's not, you know, not lots of like, dungeon crawls and creatures, and things like that. It's a lot more about the people


Jonathan Gilmour  44:36  

just wait for kids in caves.


Amelia Antrim  44:40  

in caves, Black Swan,


Doug Levandowski  44:42  



Amelia Antrim  44:45  

Dungeons. So one thing we like to do here is look at the character sheet and talk about what it tells us about the game. So we talk about the you know, the kind of design behind it. What things you really wanted to make sure we're on the character sheets, you know, what the placement of things kind of means to you? I know when we look at a sheet for something like d&d, there's lots of room for, you know, the the feats and abilities and the weapons and the like that kind of stuff. And, you know, PVTA has the has the book, where the whole inside is all your moves. So you can clearly see that that's the focus. Was there specific stuff that you wanted here? Or that you you felt like? No, I definitely don't want that on the sheets.


Jonathan Gilmour  45:35  

I feel like it was pretty organic. Like we kind of just made the character sheets. I think we did that really early in the design, like when we were talking about, you know, the, using the full set of dice for the stats, like we just started adding boxes for those. And they're like, oh, we need a backpack, so people can just write what's in their backpack there. Yeah. And I think it all just kind of evolved very organically in when we started talking about skills being more mechanical, because we really didn't want to do like, oh, I have swimming. So I did a plus one when swimming. Those kinds of things. Yeah, so, so boring. Were like, what if the, you know, the skills were trying to almost like a board game, you know, like a very mechanical thing, like you can spend adversity points to do this, or, you know, you did these really nice things that you can trigger. So, yeah, just adding in the boxes for those. And you know, letting players trying to fill stuff in themselves led me to a lot of sense. Mm hmm.


Amelia Antrim  46:38  

Yeah. From there, it's really just, you know, like answering the things that that we answered, it's a lot of, you know, like word line, name, grade, your broom, your wand, your backpack, your strengths. You know, so basically just running down the list of the things that we talked about. Yeah. Yeah, I like that. There wasn't a lot of stuff to abstract. I am not a fan of derived stats, because they involve math. thinking things through, I liked that this was just, you know, like, I pick this. So I write that down. Very simple.


Jonathan Gilmour  47:15  

Yeah, we wanted to teach the maps at just for the steel jets, like the the GM sets the difficulty you roll and figure if you're above or below and by how much. Like, that's the sum total of the math in the game. Right?


Amelia Antrim  47:29  

I love that. Um,


Ryan Boelter  47:31  

it's interesting, because I'm looking at the character sheet. And it's, it's, you know, as advertised for the game is very simplistic, and it's very straightforward. And it's everything you need to know about your character. Or everything that they have, and, and can kind of do, but one thing it also tells me is, I might need to have something for notes, like a notebook or something like that, because there's a lot going on, that involves my character that you can't account for on a character sheet, right? Aside from just a big old blank note section, which takes up a ton of space. Even


Amelia Antrim  48:15  

if we had a big Notes section, like there's no way that we could have written all the stuff from the questions or anything


Ryan Boelter  48:19  

like, Right, exactly, like, um, like, if you go to like a power by the apocalypse game, like all of the playbooks have the questions kind of stamped on the sheet itself. But when you're working with, you know, the variability of, you know, we're talking 60 potential questions for relationships per character, that are shared amongst all the characters, and then the, the tropes have their own personal questions, so that you don't want to create and kind of shoehorn yourself into, well, here's like, 20, nearly identical character sheets that just have a difference between here's your personal questions.


Amelia Antrim  49:02  

Yeah. Yeah, well, and I think definitely, it makes sense to not have them on character sheets, because those are shared questions between everybody. So you know, we answered those things. And the stories are gonna come up, even though it's between Elvira and gar, you know, and so like, it doesn't make sense for me to write those questions on my sheet, but they still might relate to something that comes, you know, like, that's kind of a shared group experience. It's not about my character.


Ryan Boelter  49:28  

Yeah. It also has the thought in my head of those questions can change. You know, we don't have to have this specific 20 questions. If we don't want to, we could maybe swap out a couple of questions. We could take a question and alter it a bit. You know, the same thing we're kind of doing with all of this broad building and relationship building. collaboratively, we can, we can kind of gear it towards what we want to do at the table, which is


Amelia Antrim  49:59  

definitely Room depending on your group for, you know, a player or a GM or somebody to say like, Hey, this is also a question we're going to add to the list. You know, like, here's a, here's a fifth question I want everybody to answer. And so there's a lot of room for, for that kind of stuff, too. Yeah, that you know, you don't, you'd end up with a 40 page character sheet, and it's just not great.


Doug Levandowski  50:21  

In the adventure prompts in strange adventures, Volume One and Volume Two, we have a bunch of those for the pregenerated towns, right. Like, their questions instead of the usual town creation questions. You do this stuff? Oh, yeah. There's also room to, to do that with the inter character functions to


Jonathan Gilmour  50:39  

Yeah, yeah. And we really wanted the game to be approachable to people who had played RPGs before too, so he didn't want the character to cheat sheet to feel overwhelming. And like homework when you looked at it play. Yeah. I mean, we looked at a second edition d&d character sheet. I remember just feeling overwhelmed by it.


Amelia Antrim  50:58  

Right skills on a hero's unlimited.


Jonathan Gilmour  51:02  

So we just wanted to, you know, we did want it to say that, you know, this wasn't gonna be work, this was gonna be fun, and it's gonna be quick, and you're not gonna have to worry about a lot of extra stuff.


Amelia Antrim  51:14  

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think you did a great job. It's very clear what, you know, I don't think there was a point where I was like, I don't know where this goes or what to do with it. It was good. And I felt like looking at the sheet, kind of, in a lot of cases, negated the need to like, look at the book, I had to go there to look up some of the, you know, options for things. But it was like, Okay, I know, if I go down from top to bottom, how to build a character like it's right there. Yeah, absolutely. its own little guide.


Ryan Boelter  51:47  

So, now we're getting into one of the questions I like to ask, especially designers of the games that we cover. What is What do you think is one of the biggest flaws of character creation in this system? And what is one of the best parts?


Jonathan Gilmour  52:04  

Pool? Um, I think I tend to read gret, us pulling back on some of the things we originally wanted to do with this system. And we'd put more of our Yeah, we talked about safety tools and things like that. But like, I really wish we'd done even more to bits off that people that don't like those things. To be honest, like, yeah, agreement on that. Yeah. More More chair, more thoughtfulness? Yeah, building off of what John said,


Doug Levandowski  52:39  

you know, I think we have short stuff about what a, you know, what safety tools can look like. But one of the things that I've been getting interested in lately, like, sort of right after kids on brooms was finalized, John and I both started getting really interested in how you build storytelling, safety mechanics into the game itself, rather than having it be,


Amelia Antrim  53:06  

oh, like an optional outside tool that you bring in, right, like, Okay,


Doug Levandowski  53:12  

so we're gonna use the x card. Okay, cool, then the x card is great. Right? But rather than having it having that happen, like, building in ways for the storytelling to require that you use it and have it just feel like it's sort of a natural part of it, right? So, you know, if you're going to enter into conflict with another character, saying, The GM saying, Are you good with this? Yes. Are you good with this? Yes, right. Boom, it doesn't feel like a, make sure you see if somebody wants to tap the expert or anything like that. It's just, you're telling the story together, you're collaborating?


Amelia Antrim  53:48  

Right. And I think when you put it into the rules of the game, and like, make it part of it, it's sort of not totally negates, obviously, but like, it does diminish the ability for people to opt out of doing that. Right. Whereas, you know, suggesting those things in the beginning people can like take them or leave them, right. Yeah, it when you make it part of the mechanics, it's like, oh, we're just playing the game, and it's safe, right?


Ryan Boelter  54:11  

Yeah. But that's like, a little bit of, like, in thirsty sort of lesbians. There's like that smitten mechanic. And I think we talked about this a little bit in the series. The there was another game that I think was sent out. And Phil, from pandas talking games was working on where you play as this group of people that have messy relationships with one another, and they have a Smit mechanic where it's like, you're not saying my character is going to, you know, flirt with your character or whatever right? is saying, My character is smitten by this other character. Does that other character buy in or not, whether it's a GM NPC or if it's another player character, and then it has to have that consent both ways for for that, that sort of roleplay to happen. And I can see that working very well for for something like conflict and, and all that sort of stuff and baking that right into the rules of like, Hey, are you both okay with this thing happening? You having a quick little check in? Right doesn't break the story at all. It doesn't break the immersion. It's just, Hey, are we being safe here? Yeah. Okay, let's go ahead. And


Amelia Antrim  55:28  

when it becomes a thing where you say like, okay, conflict is about to happen. And then you have to agree that conflict is about to happen for it to even like trigger initiative when it becomes a rule like that. Like, there's no choice except to have that discussion of like, you can't like it just doesn't work. That problems? Yeah, yeah, I think that's, that's something I would love to see in more games. Is those safety tools kind of built in there? Because then you can't end up with people who are like, I don't need that. You do? You do, actually. Absolutely.


Jonathan Gilmour  56:06  

But I've been playing with this same RPG group for 45 years. Right.


Doug Levandowski  56:12  

I wonder why no one else wants to join your RPG group.


Amelia Antrim  56:18  

I mean, are there things that you think that you've, you've really just like, nailed it?


Doug Levandowski  56:22  

I mean, like John said, this is close to exactly the game that I want to play. So


Amelia Antrim  56:31  

I think all of it then yeah, basically,


Doug Levandowski  56:33  

I think we nail it. I think a lot. I think a lot of games nail it. I think ours is one of the many games that knits. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  56:41  

Yeah. I mean, that's awesome to hear, though, that like you really are happy with it. And it's, you know, I think not enough people get to that point of like, this is, you know, the thing that I wanted to see. I think sometimes we have to kind of sacrifice things here and there to get them out into the world. And so it's always really good to hear people say like, No, this was the thing that I wanted to make.


Doug Levandowski  57:02  

Yeah. And shout out to hunters and Renegade for like, giving us just so much creative freedom on this right that there hasn't been, I don't think anything where they've said like, you can't do this. But that's awesome. In Yeah, it's, yeah, it's been, it's been great. They really have let us make the game that we wanted to make that we thought would be best. So


Ryan Boelter  57:30  

that's very cool. Very cool.


Amelia Antrim  57:32  

That's always good to hear. It makes me so happy when I made it.


Ryan Boelter  57:37  

You didn't have to Self Publish. That's right.


Amelia Antrim  57:41  

Like that's the real? Yeah, that's


Doug Levandowski  57:43  

the real win.


Amelia Antrim  57:45  

All right. Well, this is our favorite segment, the one we've been talking about this whole time. This is our fanfic segment, where we talk about playing the game. What do we what do we think? What kind of story are we throwing these characters into? How do we think it would go for them? You know, the closest we come to playing a game?


Ryan Boelter  58:05  

Yeah. Oh, goodness, we've got we've got okay, we've got a classic love triangle going on. We've got a, almost inadvertently a best friend, triangle thing going on with Jimmy Elvira and Amy Katherine. Because there's there was a lot of mentions of like, Jimmy's hanging out with Elvira in this secret room, there's, you know, you know, Jimmy helping and all this stuff. So it's like, you've got these like, really? Emotion filled relationships. Already from the get go. Yeah. So that's, that's really interesting to kind of pull off of.


Amelia Antrim  58:52  

Yeah, I mean, I think there's a question to have like, who is Amy Katherine? If she's not a virus best friend? Right? What's her like? Who is she by herself? I really would like her to participate in this, this cooking volleyball sport. Already said, Sir, ready, set serve? Because I think she could really, you know, like, that could be the place that she can shine and maybe bring the team to the top. And maybe that's something that she can do without a Vyra maybe gar can be on the team too. Oh,


Jonathan Gilmour  59:31  

I was actually gonna ask the question how God kind of got involved with us since like, there's this kind of friendship between all three of us,


Doug Levandowski  59:37  

right? Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I I think realistically if I were playing guitar, my friend who I game with weekly has jokes with me that like when I play a character, no matter what they start out as they wind up being me. So yeah, you know, I I think if I did wind up playing gar, he would sort of morph gradually, like, I think I would have to give him a redemption arc even if I'm not sure that people like him deserve redemption or


Amelia Antrim  1:00:08  

right. Oh, no, I think he was just about like his parents were never around. They're always busy with this legal battle and, you know, probably got like a series of nannies. Yeah, I think I'd have to have the torments probably.


Doug Levandowski  1:00:22  

Right. I think I'd have to have them suffer really, really badly before there was any sort of like, redemptive potential there. But I don't


Jonathan Gilmour  1:00:29  

know why that we all


Amelia Antrim  1:00:32  

suffering. Right. Right. Right.


Ryan Boelter  1:00:34  

But yeah, I think I mean, before the suffering, there's got to be something because I, I know, Elvira has got this like, awful optimism, like, underneath all of the the torment that she's been going through. And I think she would see something in gar, that even even gar won't ever acknowledge. And maybe maybe that might have pulled guard a little bit into this, this trio of sorts.


Doug Levandowski  1:01:07  

Yeah, I think at the start, there'd be a lot of guards, say, like, doing something nice, and then insisting that there was an ulterior motive for it. And I think at first, that would be true. And then I think there would be less and less room for him to say that there really was an ulterior motive. But yet, sort of a meta thing, like, I always think that when you're playing, you have to think about like, not will tell me why my character is hanging out with you. But coming up with reasons for the character to be there, right. Like, even if it's a series of like, unexpected events to put him together with the other three, that would just lead into that, right. Like, yeah, he, they all are in the infirmary together. And he happens to be there when this thing happens, like, cool. Yeah, great. He's not running off. He's saying, Well, I guess I'll stay. Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  1:02:01  

yeah. I like that. I like that. The happenstance gathering for gar storyline because Garfield's very much like a almost a loner type. Yeah. Even though he, you know, has this big persona that, you know, everybody, everybody, quote unquote, respects, to gar because of who gar is, where he comes from, and all that sort of stuff. But then, like, you know, that that doesn't equate to friendship, right. You know, I


Amelia Antrim  1:02:36  

see totally tells himself that he's alone by choice, but he's


Doug Levandowski  1:02:40  

nobody. So I don't want to hang out with them.


Amelia Antrim  1:02:44  

Right, exactly. To keep up with me,


Ryan Boelter  1:02:46  

right. But then yeah, but then you find yourself in all these situations, right? Guard gyres, this happens to be in the wrong place at the wrong time with these other three. Right? You know, whether whether Jim bees, Bumblebee, nucynta, potential trouble and somehow getting us out of it at the same time. Or, or my curses is literally like, you know, haunting us as a group or whatever, you know.


Amelia Antrim  1:03:12  

Yeah. Yeah. And we got to figure out what's up with Meredith? Right, you have to I feel like that's maybe like, the place that this starts is like, we have to figure out oh,


Jonathan Gilmour  1:03:23  

yeah, I think I think we're deeply invested in that room, and we're gonna pokin our wands into it. Yeah, absolutely.


Amelia Antrim  1:03:30  

Well, I think maybe the founder is gonna start like interning at the Borup Corporation.


Ryan Boelter  1:03:40  

Is the name it has to be


Doug Levandowski  1:03:42  

one. Yeah, their website is blur. yet.


Amelia Antrim  1:03:46  

They're a nonprofit. They are.


Doug Levandowski  1:03:47  

Yeah. Oh, Lord tenuously? Because they're nonprofits. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:03:53  

Oh, yeah. Yeah.


Jonathan Gilmour  1:03:55  

We gotta find that sock closet again. Yeah. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:03:59  

And, and I wonder if there is a link between, uh, you know, Meredith, and this, like, rumored, you know, the necropolis, I guess, beneath the school.


Amelia Antrim  1:04:15  

I forgot about the necromancy students. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:04:19  

Well, I mean, the necromancy classes are unknown thing, but like, you know, they have school projects to raise the dead, right. And those school projects are quote, unquote, discarded afterwards. Right? Um, but I mean, if you were a school that had to protect itself, from who knows what, having an undead army I'm ready. would be very helpful.


Amelia Antrim  1:04:46  

Yeah. Are there special rules for getting into the Necromancer classes? Do you have to like get a permission slip from a parent or can you just like take those? Asking for a friend?


Doug Levandowski  1:04:56  

Yeah. I think it's just Great


Ryan Boelter  1:05:00  

yeah I think if you're going to the school Anything's fair game and the classes are fair game


Amelia Antrim  1:05:05  

right well it's a it's a very prestigious yeah order of send tests


Jonathan Gilmour  1:05:11  

yeah I think we originally had like house creation as the thing didn't we


Doug Levandowski  1:05:15  

did yeah we did


Jonathan Gilmour  1:05:18  

yeah I think that would play into like what classes you could take but we decided to cut it because it was a it was too indicative of one very specific story and we just found it was too restrictive and not fun, right?


Amelia Antrim  1:05:33  

Yeah. Yeah, I don't feel like it needs it


Doug Levandowski  1:05:36  

also separated players right like there's no way that all of our characters would be in the same house however you split it up unless it's Ray and so then it's just help located things. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:05:49  

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. I don't feel like it suffered for it. It wasn't like looking for it or anything. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:05:55  

Yeah, now we can be our best selves at poof


Ryan Boelter  1:06:06  

the fourth the blog Corp secretly owns poof Yes. Is


Amelia Antrim  1:06:10  

blurb Corp located then on this island? And like Erie


Ryan Boelter  1:06:13  

Island? Oh, can't be on the island. No, it has to be


Doug Levandowski  1:06:16  

corpus. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:06:18  

Oh, he worked remotely.


Doug Levandowski  1:06:21  

My internship was remote. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:06:23  

Yeah. I mean,


Amelia Antrim  1:06:25  

it's as you travel magically and not know your location.


Ryan Boelter  1:06:32  

Okay, where is Flipkart? Maybe it's in the necropolis? Wavy all the secret ingredients.


Doug Levandowski  1:06:41  

Yeah. Oh, it's a former people,


Ryan Boelter  1:06:50  

former people and loved the description of raised from the dead people as former


Amelia Antrim  1:06:57  

former people,


Ryan Boelter  1:06:59  

just former people. They're not using their bodies anymore. It's


Jonathan Gilmour  1:07:03  

right. So our entire workforce is undead. Cross.


Doug Levandowski  1:07:10  

Right, right. Well,


Amelia Antrim  1:07:12  

I did I did go on an entirely other podcast and talk about the economics of necromancy and raising the debt. So armies are cheap labor,


Doug Levandowski  1:07:21  

you know that you know that Amazon would if they could?


Amelia Antrim  1:07:26  



Ryan Boelter  1:07:28  

Ah, bar Park? Why? Yep. Oh, goodness. Well, I, there's a lot of questions that we haven't left to answer. But my goodness, I think that we think we've solved it more than enough strings that we could be pulling on. For this fanfic? Definitely, we probably would be here for another two hours. If


Amelia Antrim  1:07:51  

we also there's, I just want put that in there. There's a prompt somewhere. Oh, one


Ryan Boelter  1:07:55  

has to be a prom. Alright. Okay, that magic prom absolute magic


Amelia Antrim  1:07:58  

check. Yeah, well, let's get into our advancement segment, who with all of that said, and we will take it up a level, take it up a level, level level. So in this segment, we like to talk about how character growth happens in the system. First, we'll just talk about how does the character level up in mechanically in this game over the course of a campaign?


Jonathan Gilmour  1:08:27  

Well, so originally in kids on bikes, we decided not to put one in purposely because we're like, I mean, if you think of like, any movie, like dad, or TV show, or comic book series, like, they don't really that much between, you know, when you're in it, and I as a kid didn't change that much from year to year. But then this week, we kind of wanted to so go ahead and talk about that.


Doug Levandowski  1:08:52  

Yeah. And then in teens in space, we kind of went in the opposite direction, right? Like, the space opera genre is like characters are getting better and better and better and better, pretty quickly. So for here, we decided that, you know, in keeping with the school aspect of it, we were going to have classes and then as you practice magic, using a particular set, you can you can gradually work your way up in the right one of the strengths that you can take is and we forgot to talk about this in the creation part. But as upperclassmen each of us would have a one of our strengths would be skilled at a particular kind of magic are trained in I think it's the Yeah, trained in one particular type of magic that gives us plus one to all spells of that type. But then we can also get to, with enough sort of checks in there, which you would get at the end of the session, right? So I would say, Yeah, gar used really a lot of like, fight magic in here. So he's gonna take a check in that. And then over time, that would be converted into him becoming studied in that, which gives him a plus three. And then ultimately master of which would give him a plus five. Oh, nice. Okay. But other than that, that's, that's pretty much it right? We wanted to keep this focused on the way that your character narratively changes, right? The way that your your bonds with other characters change. Yeah. And that sort of thing.


Ryan Boelter  1:10:23  

Now does the mechanical benefit represent something in the story of like advanced eating or classes or anything like that?


Doug Levandowski  1:10:31  

It's really just practice, right? That the more you practice a kind of magic, the better you're gonna get at it. Okay,


Amelia Antrim  1:10:38  

so, very cool. I like that. I like that it lines up. I always, I always prefer when narratively there's some kind of explanation for you know, sailing. It's no fun when you've been like doing this campaign to the desert and it's like my next level is sailing.


Doug Levandowski  1:10:55  

Been thinking about sailing


Amelia Antrim  1:10:57  

is really just like really thinking about boats.


Ryan Boelter  1:10:59  

Yep, I wish I wish we had a boat and get water.


Amelia Antrim  1:11:03  

Right, exactly. That's what it was. It was like so parched that I thought about nothing but water for months. And now I know how to sail. Yeah, like when it's not a stretch?


Ryan Boelter  1:11:15  

Absolutely. Um, yeah, that seems like it's, it's kind of nice. Opening for some advancing for a little bit longer of a campaign. It doesn't kind of push you into like a one or two shot. Or even, you know, maybe like a foreshadow. So it leaves room to have an ongoing thing for a while, you know, until you until you graduate. Are you sure? Yeah. So it sounds like there is some sort of ending point, at the very least.


Amelia Antrim  1:11:45  

Right? Right. Which again, always prefer?


Ryan Boelter  1:11:48  

Absolutely. Well, is there anything else that you wanted to point out before we we wrapped up the series Dogger or John?


Jonathan Gilmour  1:11:58  

I don't think so. Don't do anything. I think I'm good.


Ryan Boelter  1:12:01  

Yeah. I'm very cool.


Doug Levandowski  1:12:03  

Oh, well. I will. I do have to do one small plug here. Yes. If you enjoy kids on brooms and you want to add another element to the game, there is also a game called duel of wands, which is a two player card game of spell slinging had each other in the kids on brooms universe that you can integrate into the game.


Amelia Antrim  1:12:26  

Oh, I saw that on Instagram earlier when I was like scrolling through like I searched like the hashtag. Yeah, rooms, and it came up. It looked fun. It's really pretty art.


Doug Levandowski  1:12:36  

Yeah. Heather did the art for that one. And as always, she just let me she knocks everything she said. So yeah, so shameless self promotion for that one. Yes.


Amelia Antrim  1:12:50  

We'll put a link to it in the in the description. Thank you.


Ryan Boelter  1:12:54  

Absolutely. Well, Doug, Jonathan, thank you both so much for joining us to talk about kids on brooms. This was really fantastic. So


Amelia Antrim  1:13:03  

so much fun. Like this is what a good game.


Jonathan Gilmour  1:13:08  

And thank you for having us. Yeah,


Doug Levandowski  1:13:09  

this was great. This was as much fun as I've ever had on a podcast interview. So yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:13:16  

Well, can you both sigh, remind everyone where they can find you online and the other things you're working on?


Doug Levandowski  1:13:21  

Truthfully. I am on Twitter at Doug Levin dev si le van de OWSKI, where I talk somewhat infrequently about my stuff. And I'm not a daily poster there even though I know for the algorithm I ought to be but John and I are working on secret kids on project. We are also working on kids in capes with four other folks who have just also so awesome to work with. And working on a game called home about surviving the night in a haunted house with you and son Kim. And I think that's everything that's been announced. So yeah, very cool.


Amelia Antrim  1:14:09  

We should just continue making jokes of other kids on things like I want to be like kids on planes. Yep.


Jonathan Gilmour  1:14:16  

That one's just gonna be snakes on planes and you're just playing the snakes from the movie


Amelia Antrim  1:14:20  

but it's it's child snakes though. I just want to be clear that like there are baby snakes Yeah, there may


Doug Levandowski  1:14:25  

be saints banana wrote an adventure prompt for that in the free content Friday for 2020


Amelia Antrim  1:14:33  

Oh, nice. We got to go find all of these cool bonus ones of like dads on mowers and sneak clean and pretty soon I will right moms and target I'm just I have no idea like where to even start with that. But I don't want to


Jonathan Gilmour  1:14:49  

anyway. And you can find me on Twitter at John Gilmore Jong IO MO You are I also don't post there as much as I should. But I tried to link projects and have discussions from time to time. And if you want to check out things that I've done recently, co lab was just on Kickstarter, and that'll be delivering later this year. There should be a link to preorder it on the Kickstarter page. And a few other projects coming up that hopefully, we'll be able to talk more about soon. Very cool, as well as the stuff that I talked about.


Amelia Antrim  1:15:26  

Well, thank you both so much for sitting down with us. This was like I had a blast. This was so fun. And thank you to everyone for tuning in.


Ryan Boelter  1:15:39  

Call to Action. Yeah, like that. I love the kids on series of games, so much that for what you can create in it, like I came into these series not really knowing much about what the games are about, aside from Oh, you can do Stranger Things or the Goonies or whatever. Right. But it's it's a lot more malleable than that. Like, you've got the the relationship questions, the world building, you've got a like, like very malleable character creation options in there as well.


Amelia Antrim  1:16:18  

Yeah, I mean, I really was I was really uncertain. Like, I will be out there and say I was really uncertain going into these ones because I knew about kids on bikes. And I knew it was based off of Stranger Things, which has such strong d&d vibes, that I was like, Why did you make a game based off a show of it's heavily influenced by another game? Like that seems to meta, and then, you know, I'm like, and then there's a magical kids one that I'm always like, I don't want to play Harry Potter. Like, I just, it always goes there. I know, when we did our starcrossed episodes, I very distinctly said, I don't want this to be Hogwarts. And so I was really just like, not sure what to expect going into this. And I think we do get a little, we got into that a little bit in this episode, about, you know, how it's not Hogwarts. And I was, I was just really surprised at how sleek the mechanics were and how thoughtful a lot of it was considering the source of the ideas and things. It was just, it was really cool. It was really quite a way with a much greater appreciation for it than I thought I would.


Ryan Boelter  1:17:22  

Absolutely. And I know we probably could have gotten so many more places, but the fanfic are so many threads timer, so many threads, like we did a full relationship. You know, web positive, negative character, relationships between every character airing and yeah, it was. It was fantastic and create a so much story that you can pull on. So yeah, very, very impressed by this whole this whole game. And yeah, in the series, I'm really looking forward to the next one. I can't


Amelia Antrim  1:17:58  

wait to see what they do with like kids and capes and some of their other projects. Like it's just it is really interesting, because they're all genres that are like, we already have games for that. But they're really doing things differently. Absolutely. It's cool. It's very cool. So before we let you go to the outtakes announcements, a call to action. You know, we'll try and keep it shorter maybe than we did earlier?


Ryan Boelter  1:18:20  

Absolutely. Probably. So check out our brand new tic tac page at Character Creation Cast on tic tac, I'm going to be keeping on posting those teasers there, but like, what else do you want to see? Let us know. Maybe we'll do something else. So ideas are nice. You can hit us up on Twitter at creation cast or on Discord at discord, character creation


Amelia Antrim  1:18:45  

Please check out the trans rights bundle on Twitch. It's going to be ending fairly soon. But it's such a good deal. It is a suggested donation of $5. It helps kids that are suffering down in Texas after some really damaging anti trans legislation. So please check that out. Consider giving more than the minimum amount if you're able to, in order to help people out but it is like 500 games. So yeah, you know, it's a great deal.


Ryan Boelter  1:19:18  

And if you have some time, after all of that, consider leaving a rating and review for our podcast. You know, Stitcher doesn't do reviews anymore, but we still have Apple podcasts, which I know is a pain for some people. And we also have pod chaser, which is much less of a pain for everybody. Um, and there's also places like podcast addict on Android that you can leave reviews. And that's kind of it. There's


Amelia Antrim  1:19:47  

our Facebook page. We do have a paid Facebook page for our show. And you can leave reviews there as well. Yeah, there's not


Ryan Boelter  1:19:55  

there's not too many review places out there. But if you leave a review somewhere like very nice Let us know. And we'll read it as well. On on the show out of reviews again. So we would love to get more to read on the next episodes.


Amelia Antrim  1:20:09  

Yeah, and definitely if you've left us one and we haven't read it like, please let us know too because I think we've we've tried to catch them all from all of the places and aggregate them. But if for some reason we've missed yours, please let us know because we want to read them. We have, we will have at some point soon. Maybe by the time this comes out, I don't know an episode on the One Shot network Patreon feed where I make characters with my kids using weird scouts RPG, you can get access to that by becoming a patron at the $5 up level at Shot podcast. We are also going to be adding new shirts to the network's T public store. So if you're looking for some C three merch, we will have you covered there. We'll put a link to that in the show notes. But I'm excited for some of the designs that I've been playing around with.


Ryan Boelter  1:20:59  

Yeah, time. I'm very excited for it. I know for


Amelia Antrim  1:21:03  

years and we really needed to definitely still want to commission an artist for some stuff. It's just been, you know, like a question of finding the finances and stuff because we don't get paid to make this show. Absolutely. We want to pay artists what they're worth so


Ryan Boelter  1:21:19  

absolutely. So please check that out. And also check out our bonus episode from last week about Yes, zebras bed and breakfast, a slice of life RPG that is currently crowdfunding, the crowdfunding on IndieGoGo and not Kickstarter, so check out there. We'll have a link in the show notes. But please listen to that episode. If you enjoy what you hear, check out their IndieGoGo page, we really had a fantastic discussion about playing shared characters and what exactly makes something in RPG. We were really excited for the game and hope you'll be too. There's gonna be a link to that campaign in our show notes.


Amelia Antrim  1:22:03  

That's it for March episodes. We cannot wait for you to join us for April, as we celebrate four years of character creation for years for more years by covering a truly amazing game. You will not want to miss those episodes. They are excellent. Brian hasn't added him yet, but I was there when we recorded them and they were excellent. So please don't miss it and join us in celebrating four years. Absolutely. Until then take care of yourselves, drink some water, get some rest get vaccinated, stay safe, keep making those amazing people. We'll see you next time.


Ryan Boelter  1:23:09  

Character Creation Cast is a production of the One Shot Podcast Network and can be found online at www dot character creation Head to the website to get more information on our hosts this show and even our press kit. Character Creation Cast can also be found on twitter at creation cast or ON OUR DISCORD SERVER at discord character creation I am one of your hosts Ryan boelter and I can be found on twitter at Learn Neptune or online at Lord Our other host Amelia Antrim can be found on twitter at ginger reckoning. Music for this episode is used with a Creative Commons license, or with permission from the podcast they originated from. Further information can be found within the show notes. Our main theme music is hero remix by Steve combs, and is used with a Creative Commons license. This podcast is owned by us under Creative Commons. This episode was edited by Ryan boelter. Further information for the game systems used and today's guests can be found in the show notes. If you'd like to leave us a rating or review. We have links to various review platforms out there including Apple podcasts in our show notes. Also check the show notes for links to our other projects. Thanks for joining us. I remember we find that the best part of any role playing game is character creation. So go out there and create some amazing people. We will see you next time.


Amelia Antrim  1:24:56  

Now we got to read some show blurbs show blurbs shout show by show blurbs. Character Creation Cast is hosted by the One Shot Podcast Network. If you enjoyed our show, visit one shot where you'll find other great shows like Neo scam.


Ryan Boelter  1:25:13  

News comm is a narrative comedy podcast featuring five Chicago improvisers antagonizing their way through the role playing classic Shadowrun. It follows a group of misfits and outsiders z the acerbic cyber troublemaker, packs the candy junkie klepto from across the pond tech wizard, the Public Access actor with a petulant thirst for adventure. And Dec Rambo the nastiest trucker this side of the rubble Mason Dixon join the arrestable Neo scum crew on a pure aisle rockin road trip through a weirdo World of Tomorrow, doling out street justice to every debe they encounter. Whether they deserve it or not the recording, there we go. Oh, look, I


Jonathan Gilmour  1:26:07  

thought we're gonna start on one. So they don't need to start over. That's fine.


Ryan Boelter  1:26:11  

It's close enough. Close enough. Okay, well, we'll make it work. It looks different. This is my first time recording in the new version of Audacity, and it's weirding me out because it looks different.


Amelia Antrim  1:26:22  

I don't like change. So I would


Ryan Boelter  1:26:25  

just add a little line at the top. It's


Jonathan Gilmour  1:26:30  

a little level line or one of the other ones. Yeah, I wouldn't use it unless you're here to


Ryan Boelter  1:26:33  

Yeah, it's, there's like a little line that has the clip name on it. And so you can actually like when you're editing, you can move those clips around and put in different audio files as clips. And wow. And it works. Just like almost every other editing program there is.


Amelia Antrim  1:26:55  

I know I just got mad at printers for not changing over several years. But I would also like other things to not change. Like I've been overdue for a new phone for like a year and a half. And there's cracks in the screen and like the touch screens starting to get funky. But like, I don't want, like the world is so unstable right now. And the idea of having to learn a new interface on a phone is like too much for me. It's too much too much can't do it. I forgot to take my Adderall before we started. So quick.


Ryan Boelter  1:27:25  

There we go. Now we can hear you.


Amelia Antrim  1:27:27  

Oh, I had to move my mic closer. So I forgot to take my Adderall before we started and was like, Oh, if this is going to be successful, we're going to go ahead and do that. Alright. Sorry about that. No words. Just saying. You get see No, that's not true. We don't even get one swear word. Brian doesn't want us. So


Ryan Boelter  1:27:49  

it'll get an AA language. Bleep to it. Yep. It's fine.


Amelia Antrim  1:27:54  

Yep. Nate says that now when I swear. I swear in front of my son. He now uses Ryan's language. He puts in the podcast episodes. Great.


Ryan Boelter  1:28:06  

I I'm glad that Yep.


Amelia Antrim  1:28:12  

He did it.


Ryan Boelter  1:28:13  

I think I did it like half a second. Maybe even half a second too late.


Amelia Antrim  1:28:17  

You're the one that says quickie. How can you do it late?


Ryan Boelter  1:28:19  

I was a little confused because I'm on one screen. I don't know why. But my waveforms look nice. But that's the important part.


Amelia Antrim  1:28:29  

I'm writing myself a little poster that says audacity update. Stick it on my monitor and then promptly ignore it.


Ryan Boelter  1:28:35  

It's not bad. It's just kind of little bar at the top. It makes it look more modular.


Amelia Antrim  1:28:40  

Oh, yeah. See, I was even talking about like the the difference thing. It's just that that's like the ADHD thing is that like, I'll see the note. And then eventually, if the note is there too long, it becomes part of the decor. And I don't see it anymore. I understand that. I had to like move around the sticky notes for me to remind myself to get the kids their medications because like I got so used to seeing it. Like I put it on the door thinking when we walk out the door, it'll be there and I'll see like for walk out the door like oh, no, stop. There's a train. And, you know, it worked like that for like three days. Yeah. And it was


Ryan Boelter  1:29:18  

so every time you use the note you move it somewhere else.


Amelia Antrim  1:29:22  

Right, right. I actually like put the medication in the drawer in the kitchen. Right where the like sandwich bags and stuff are so I see the medication when I'm making sandwiches. Yeah, lunches, right there.


Ryan Boelter  1:29:34  

Well, that's what you got to do.


Amelia Antrim  1:29:37  

So, but yeah, you do it again.


Ryan Boelter  1:29:39  

Yeah. account for as much as possible.


Amelia Antrim  1:29:43  

Right, right. Sometimes the kids remind me, like, Sunday, I wanted them to do something in Nicosia. You're gonna need to medicate me for that. And I was like, Thank you for knowing yourself. I will do that. That's a good reminder. I'm gonna go take mine too. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:30:01  

Ah, well, in three weeks or so construction might begin for my new studio. So I'm very excited for that. And I have no idea what I'm going to do with my desk. In the meantime, probably the other side of the basement and hope for the best. Yeah, that sounds fun.


Amelia Antrim  1:30:23  

How you gonna work through like that?


Ryan Boelter  1:30:26  

Work on the other side of the basement and hope for the best.


Amelia Antrim  1:30:29  

Oh, I see. That was that was the whole plan. I thought there was like a step two there. That was the whole site. Okay. Yep.


Ryan Boelter  1:30:37  

I really would like to put my my curtains slash my blankets hanging from the ceiling. But I cannot in that room. Unfortunately, we have to clear out space in this room down here. So they can have construction materials and enough room to put up the walls. Because they need to lay the walls down and then push them upwards. Yeah, position in blog. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  1:30:59  

like some like cool barn raising. Yeah. So they got to do that and built the basement before. I have actually. Oh, wow. Like twice. Um, but I'm not obviously by myself. But my dad is extremely handy. And so we have Pete he finishes his own basements. Oh, that's amazing. Yeah, he did. He built like a full like he fully finished our basement at our last house had like a bathroom and a bedroom and a fireplace. And like,


Ryan Boelter  1:31:27  

that's amazing. The whole shebang. The always blows me in a way that people can do that. I know. I wish I knew her on and it's like, this all got created somehow. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:31:38  

I wish I knew. I feel like if somebody like walked me through, I could roughly get it done. The part that I could not get is that like measure twice cut once then I'd be like, measure 12 times cut like, like roughly 47 Yeah, times because I'm bad at math. Yeah, it would end up being like four times expense as expensive for me, because I would just like mess it up so much. Yeah, you know, but I get that construction as maths is what I'm saying?


Ryan Boelter  1:32:05  

Well, right. I saw this architecture. So Right. I get that. I understand.


Amelia Antrim  1:32:10  

Yeah. Like, I'm fine. Like doing the stuff with my like, but I need somebody to like, write math at it for me. Yeah. So I have no problem, like doing all the pay, like putting all the stuff up and nailing things and hammering and with the tools and whatnot. But pain, or whatnot. I just can't I can't map it out.


Ryan Boelter  1:32:30  

No, that's fine. Yeah, yeah. Just have somebody else method for you. And then then you can do everything. Right. Exactly. Yeah, you're all set. But yeah, I I'm looking forward to a new studio because then I can get consistent waveforms. Because right now I peek whenever I laugh real hard. Oh, so like, I'm going through these edits. And every single time I see myself laugh. I know it's gonna crackle a little bit. So then


Amelia Antrim  1:32:57  

yeah, because it's too echoey in there are like, but I


Ryan Boelter  1:33:01  

think it's just because I I've had to, like turn down the game and compensate by getting close to the mic. Yeah. And then when I'm too close to the mic and conversation, and I laugh real loud. It just peaks just


Amelia Antrim  1:33:13  

now you got to like, learn to lean back when you lean back and laugh. lean into it. Yeah, do that old lean and laugh.


Ryan Boelter  1:33:19  

You laugh lol. Lol. Lol. Lol. Um, but yeah, it's, it's annoying. But I've got this cool little thing where I can just go into the waveform highlight that little peak, and D D crackle it nice. And it just gets rid of it. So fancy. I know. If only I got paid for all this work. So I could actually like, afford the tools that I bought. Yeah. Yeah, we got to fix that right on Sunday. Yeah. So called up in five minutes into it. I heard of that. Um, you know, we get most of our outtakes from these cold so hello, takes


Amelia Antrim  1:34:10  

I shouldn't think of anything else that I want to put in here. I don't think so. Oh, God. Oh, should we put in here that you made us a tic tock now?


Jonathan Gilmour  1:34:22  

Oh, yeah, the tic tac? Tic duckies. Hey, get out of the closet.


Amelia Antrim  1:34:27  

Do go


Ryan Boelter  1:34:30  

after the thing. Speaking of Patreon blah. One last announcement.


Amelia Antrim  1:34:37  

Looking for trouble. Would you be looking for something? Hi.


Doug Levandowski  1:34:44  

I know.


Amelia Antrim  1:34:46  

You're a very beautiful talk. Yeah. Yeah, just the prettiest dog ever. Prius talk to ever live. Yeah, yeah. And these people on the podcast will never know because they can't see you know, No, no definitely not supposed to hear you


Ryan Boelter  1:35:02  

unless they follow your your Twitter.


Amelia Antrim  1:35:05  

True unless they follow me on Twitter or Instagram den. They know how beautiful you are. Yeah, it's very beautiful. Marchin scritches for time I start to move my hand away, she moves her back underneath it. She likes to do a while I'm trying to play video games, too. She needs to try and get her nose under my fingers. I'm like, I need those buttons. Peggy is our boss fight? Like to interrupt the boss fights? Yeah. Yeah. The boss. Peggy is the final boss.


Ryan Boelter  1:35:37  

Okay. Last thing, I'm not saying before I go.


Amelia Antrim  1:35:44  

I'd love to figure out what else to do with that Tiktok pitch. But


Ryan Boelter  1:35:48  

I know right? I'm in one day, we might think of something clever. But we could do


Amelia Antrim  1:35:52  

like mini fanfics. Just like many


Ryan Boelter  1:35:58  

we could do. We could do. Your dog doing? Character creation? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. And then use your hands. Roll the dice and write down stuff on character sheets. That'd be adorable. Could I beg has


Amelia Antrim  1:36:19  

it might make me finally get Tiktok


Ryan Boelter  1:36:21  

like and subscribe. Is that what they say? as the kids


Amelia Antrim  1:36:27  

say? sure to smash that like button or something? That whatever the youth say.


Ryan Boelter  1:36:35  

Okay, I think we got it. Nailed it. Nailed it. 10 minutes in, and we're ready to start. Yeah. All right. I'll start over there.


Amelia Antrim  1:36:47  

Probably my dog's walking toward the door. So I think she's gonna start banging on the door handle here shortly. Oh, no. Get off my desk. Oh, she


Ryan Boelter  1:36:55  

just wants your soda. Get off my desk. Okay, so that's not fun dog goes.


Amelia Antrim  1:37:01  

I will sit here and pet you if that will keep you crazy. I


Ryan Boelter  1:37:04  

go. Okay, all right here comes to silent.


Amelia Antrim  1:37:09  

Did you hear that? Bill? Oh, you probably can't because the microphone. She's letting out like the loudest snore. It's like, I mean, it sounds like she's snoring. Oh, there you go. Okay, we're gonna do our best she's playing fetch with herself right now. All right.


Ryan Boelter  1:37:24  

We'll see what happens. Yeah, well,


Amelia Antrim  1:37:25  

we'll try it. Well,


Ryan Boelter  1:37:27  

there we go. Okay. Welcome to the first episode of serious foreign aid. Yeah, I Okay. We'll try that again.


Amelia Antrim  1:37:38  

Um, so yeah, that's I like Girl Scout cookies if you like them, too. Oh, my dog just straight up at me. She was trying to play with a toy and then she beat me out.


Amelia Antrim  1:37:53  

Okay. You know, I tell everybody that like, that's the fun of ADHD is that life is full of surprises from yourself, that's for sure. She really got me holy crap. You're playing tug of war. And she like went to like, grab it. Because I was like, if I'm playing with her, she'll be quiet. Kind of. Yeah. Alright. Scrolling down, reading the rest of this. It did. Under 30 minutes.


Doug Levandowski  1:38:35  

So, Ryan, what got you into podcasting?


Ryan Boelter  1:38:37  

Um, I was listening to podcasts back in 2017. I think it was I first started listening to podcasts, decided, hey, I'll start listening to stuff about role playing games, because I haven't been able to play for ages. Because you know, friends don't live near me anymore. Yeah. And I was like, Well, what what podcasts are out there. So I started listening to DMS block, which is like, based around advice for dungeon, Master's and stuff. And then they were having issues with their website because I wanted more information on some stuff. I do web design as well. Oh, so I reached out to them and said, Hey, do you need any help? And they're like, Yeah, we have no idea what we're doing. Because the guy that sent all of that up, it's no longer with the show. And so I became their webmaster. Okay. And then they asked me to judge the second season of The Geek wars podcast, which is like a big trivia show for just geeky trivia. And so I did the first episode with just a junky headset, like a USB headset, like no sound bleed protection at all and really bad microphone. And, and I said, you know, that There's gonna be quite a few episodes of this, I should probably upgrade to a better mic because when I do things I want to do them right. So even if it was just going to be this like 10 episode season of guests judging on a show, I wanted to have good audio quality. Well, that led me down a rabbit hole and listening to more podcasts. And then I wanted to create this podcast and it just kind of spiraled from there. So now now I do this with Amelia, you know, once or twice a month we do recordings. And then I added this and then I've gone from editing just this to actually editing actual plays, and audio dramas as well. So I do like full soundscapes full sound design, music placement, music and sound alterations and all that sort of fun stuff.


Amelia Antrim  1:41:01  

Trying to eat some thin mints I haven't had any yet. I have been so good. They have been in my house for like four days I'm at any segments yet.


Ryan Boelter  1:41:10  

Oh, this is your first thing meant indulgence


Amelia Antrim  1:41:14  

eliminates but if needed instruments the kids ate like a bunch but I had so many boxes of segments in my house and I haven't eaten any.


Doug Levandowski  1:41:22  

Wow, they're new French toast ones are so good. Oh yeah, that's


Ryan Boelter  1:41:27  

what I am so sad that they got rid of thanks a lot. Because I know the ones that are just a shortbread with chocolate on the bottom.


Amelia Antrim  1:41:37  

Oh yeah, they got rid of those a while ago.


Ryan Boelter  1:41:38  

I know. I'm so sad. Everybody was mad


Amelia Antrim  1:41:41  

about them getting rid of the smart ones this year to replace them with those like brownie, the adventure fools. The brownies, garbage. They like a brownie and like salted caramel in the middle. They're amazing.


Ryan Boelter  1:41:51  

I had very low expectations for those. Then when I had one I was like these are actually way better than they ought to be.


Doug Levandowski  1:42:01  

They're crunchy. They need to be chewed. They were chewy to be out of this was


Ryan Boelter  1:42:05  

see that's that's the weird thing is if I I'm thinking the opposite if they were chewy, it would lose chewy every time.


Amelia Antrim  1:42:14  

I need to try them now that they're like room temperature we got a box you know like as a here's the new cookie. Everybody gets a box. But they were like handing them out from outside. So it was very cold. And we did not want to wait that Carmona center was pretty hard. So


Ryan Boelter  1:42:32  

the cold car Maltese. Yeah, there is a flavor to like fresh out of the freezer. That like permeates whatever flavor of Girl Scout Cookie you're gonna be eating


Amelia Antrim  1:42:47  

well this was not freezer flavor this was outside was constant flavor.


Ryan Boelter  1:42:51  

I don't hear the difference Shay Are we all set to continue on with the questions? Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think so. Excellent.


Amelia Antrim  1:43:05  

I have now finished shooting so yes, we can go ahead. I don't think I have so good


Ryan Boelter  1:43:14  

all right. And now we can go ahead and stop these recordings here. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  1:43:21  

my dogs really loud back that I was trying to see if it showed up in the waveforms, but it doesn't so


Ryan Boelter  1:43:26  

anybody can sound kind of


Amelia Antrim  1:43:30  

like squeaky it's just like, you know, it's like


Ryan Boelter  1:43:35  

Nashi. Yeah. There you go.


Amelia Antrim  1:43:40  

This is like oh boy am I gonna move you over here and then move this over here because otherwise my my microphone stand is in the way what was it something the legs? Yeah. Long legs. I wasn't long legs because long legs would be like normally sexy it was something that was like


Ryan Boelter  1:44:05  

a huge legs huge huge leg huge leg. Audio somewhere yeah


Amelia Antrim  1:44:12  

some way let me know. Yeah, I'll try to find the weeks let me know what that


Ryan Boelter  1:44:18  

yeah, that was part of the Jeff and John recording right? Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:44:23  

Cuz I like for some reason I want to say it starts with the D because that's like in my like, but I don't know what it would be. Yeah. Johanna like, you're like I'm sure that it sounds like and then you find out what the word is. And it's like not that


Ryan Boelter  1:44:36  

at all. Nothing remotely like Right? Yeah, yeah. Just yeah, that's together. Yeah. It's fine. Okay, basements almost done. I have to take this down. This this bookshelf before the next recording. So next recording, there's just going to be, I guess a blanket behind me. I don't know. A basement No, not a basement of tablets. It's hanging from the rafters still, because it's still gonna be in my blanket for it for the recording on Sunday soundproofing but the outside outside of the blanket for there will be walls up like the I don't know what you call them. Frames.


Amelia Antrim  1:45:19  

Yeah, like the wood part. Yeah, yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:45:22  

So the wood parts been done this week as well as the electrical wiring. Very cool so I'm excited. Very very cool. One step closer. Yeah


Doug Levandowski  1:45:38  

All right podcast


Ryan Boelter  1:45:39  

recording the cold open. I'm going to walk.


Amelia Antrim  1:45:42  

I will do a five count and then we'll do it. I will set then we'll sing but we're not going to sing. Same the cold open the cold up episode


Amelia Antrim  1:45:59  

Yeah, let's just do that. Already.


Ryan Boelter  1:46:02  

Yep. All right. I'm gonna do the recap. Quick before I forget. Last time on Character Creation Cast. We created a magic school called poof. With headmistress Meredith bleep blurp trying to keep saying


Amelia Antrim  1:46:23  

I am not part of these recaps, but I forgot we called it Yep. Poof.


Ryan Boelter  1:46:35  

Headmistress Meredith Meredith bleep blurred this


Amelia Antrim  1:46:39  

bleep blur. We let you go for the week. Oh, I guess? Yes. I was like waiting for you. Because I'm like I'd said some stuff. I said things about game. Which, by the way, is what I do through all of the episodes, so I don't know why you got to put it in the cold open to like, things about will say things about game called actually do four hours of spacing.


Ryan Boelter  1:47:07  

Yeah, it's one of those friendly like, Hey, welcome to our new space. Sit down. We're gonna talk about how we like to see a menu. It's a nice little segue. Here's a little, a little taste of what we enjoy. Yeah. Interesting, a little bit of relationship leading questions and,


Amelia Antrim  1:47:26  

you know, sure, as well. So now, do you say that because you know that you can't leave one in podcast addict on Apple?


Ryan Boelter  1:47:38  

That there is no podcast addict?


Amelia Antrim  1:47:40  

Yeah, there is because I was just using it. There is


Ryan Boelter  1:47:42  

no Yeah, no, you're blowing my mind. Yeah. Why? Oh, no. You


Amelia Antrim  1:47:46  

know what? No, there's not. You're right. Oh, Pike Pocket Casts is the one that I use. Oh, yes, that's right.


Ryan Boelter  1:47:52  

You're right. We have reviews on packet cast. Can you? I don't know. Okay.


Amelia Antrim  1:47:57  

I don't know. I usually try to leave them on iTunes because that's like, the easiest for everybody. You are I just yell into the void of Twitter. Hey, Twitter. Aha, look at this show.


Ryan Boelter  1:48:08  

On Twitter. Boy.


Amelia Antrim  1:48:12  

Hey, the winner.


Ryan Boelter  1:48:14  

Okay. Yeah, so most of that's gonna get cut out but


Amelia Antrim  1:48:19  

right. So just to just to refresh after I interrupted Brian, very rudely and you don't hear any of it because it gets it all out. You cannot leave reviews on Stitcher stitcher pretended they were sad. I don't know if they are, you can still leave reviews on Apple podcasts, which is apparently easy if you have something with iOS, but maybe not as easy on a computer because it always wants you to update. There's also pod chaser which you can get to from the internet. Also podcast addict if you're on Android, but apparently not on iPhone. Did everybody follow along? There will be a test afterwards?


Ryan Boelter  1:48:57  

I have a question. Yeah. No further questions.


Amelia Antrim  1:49:03  

That's not a question.


Ryan Boelter  1:49:04  

I have another question. Okay, why not? Okay,


Amelia Antrim  1:49:09  

I'm gonna say science. Hey, that's what I usually tell my son when he says why. Now science


Ryan Boelter  1:49:16  

is true. I mean, technically, technically always true.


Amelia Antrim  1:49:19  

Okay, if people are still here


Ryan Boelter  1:49:25  

we're gonna worry no, takes territory right


Amelia Antrim  1:49:27  

now a really long day. And I'm just like, I thought it accidentally deleted all my emails. None of my sent items are showing up for the last week.


Ryan Boelter  1:49:40  

Come back in next week as we dive fully. Oh, gosh, that's not right. Come back


Amelia Antrim  1:49:45  

next week.


Ryan Boelter  1:49:48  

Come back next. We did.


Amelia Antrim  1:49:53  

I mean, just barely,


Ryan Boelter  1:49:55  

just barely. Oh, stopping that audio He


Amelia Antrim  1:50:01  

nailed it again. Every time. I'm getting pretty good at this.


Ryan Boelter  1:50:07  

I was I was very frightened last episode that I had started the recording. And I was using the wrong source possibly, like the waveforms look perfectly fine. As we've learned, that doesn't mean anything doesn't mean anything when I literally just installed a new version of Audacity, like two days ago. Yeah.


Jonathan Gilmour  1:50:28  

Audacity, like every three minutes and verified. I'm still recording. Yeah. Yeah, I was


Amelia Antrim  1:50:34  

a little thing in the background, that whole thing with my microphone, like, where my waveforms looked fine. But then Ryan went to edit it had just like cut off like the whole top


Ryan Boelter  1:50:41  

of Yeah, so like it cut off everything. 1000 hertz and above? Yep. As if it was recording through zoom or whatever. Yeah, I think over zoom, in most of the recording are the things for video conferencing, they cut off those upper frequencies to lower the the bandwidth of the sound coming through. So if you pull that in from there, it it's very tinny. Right. But I found this program that you can throw the waveforms at. And it does this like studio sound sort of thing and it adds that back in somehow. Oh, yeah. Like artificial intelligence.


Amelia Antrim  1:51:21  

Yeah, it sounds okay. Like I can still hear it in some places, obviously. Especially like that recording is just you know, better anyway. But yeah, with the children and children don't have good mic etiquette. Yep.


Jonathan Gilmour  1:51:33  

I was trying to hoping that you recorded it and improvised all your lines. Yep, no, I guess it's just that


Amelia Antrim  1:51:45  

one person's audio and Oh, no.


Ryan Boelter  1:51:48  

Oh, that would that would be very awkward at points.


Amelia Antrim  1:51:51  

That would be kind of fun. And then now we can stop our recording so you can stop them. We did it.


Ryan Boelter  1:51:59  

Cool. Yay. Yeah, please. Yeah, please.


Amelia Antrim  1:52:05  

Yeah, cookies. Look how good I click eat.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:12  

The cookie, the cookie. It's coming back at you.


Amelia Antrim  1:52:16  

Go somewhere to begin with.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:19  

I'm not really sure. Okay. Bring it back. Bring it back the click


Amelia Antrim  1:52:24  

from wherever it went. From wherever it went


Unknown Speaker  1:52:27  

wherever it went. Exactly.


Amelia Antrim  1:52:29  

Oh my gosh. Can you imagine starting an episode without clicking? No, I cannot lose my mind. Yeah, we used to not do that though.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:35  

It hurts. Yeah, I know. Because I am currently the original three series. Call to


Amelia Antrim  1:52:45  

Action. Yeah, like that.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:50  

All right. Stoppa the podcast.


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