Character Creation Cast

Series 49.3 - Marvel Super Heroes with Jef and Jon [System Mastery] (Discussion)

Episode Summary

Welcome to the final episode of series 49, everyone! This series, we welcome Jef and Jon from the System Mastery Podcast, to learn about a really old game, Marvel Super Heroes, a superheroic RPG by TSR that a lot have coined the FASERIP system (not affiliated with the actual FASERIP RPG). This episode we discuss the process and have a little therapy time for… surviving the Marvel Super Heroes character creation process!

Episode Notes

Welcome to the final episode of series 49, everyone! This series, we welcome Jef and Jon from the System Mastery Podcast, to learn about a really old game, Marvel Super Heroes, a superheroic RPG by TSR that a lot have coined the FASERIP system (not affiliated with the actual FASERIP RPG). This episode we discuss the process and have a little therapy time for… surviving the Marvel Super Heroes character creation process!

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Jef and Jon (System Mastery) @SystemMastery

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Marvel Super Heroes

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Episode Transcription

Transcripts Automatically Generated - Not 100% Accurate

Ryan Boelter  0:01  

Welcome to the final episode of Series 49. Everyone, we've made it, we survived the actual game mechanic somehow, in this episode, we just get to have a little therapy session about it because we deserve it.

 

Amelia Antrim  0:17  

It's I mean, it's important to like, unwind, and you know, to have that like kind of cooldown session afterwards. Check in with everybody. How you doing? Was this traumatic for you? Yes, it was. Yes. This is the importance of you know, talking about believe and

 

Ryan Boelter  0:37  

there's supposed to be bleed with character creation.

 

Amelia Antrim  0:39  

Right. Yeah. You know,

 

Ryan Boelter  0:43  

at least character creation mechanics. Right. Right.

 

Unknown Speaker  0:46  

Right.

 

Amelia Antrim  0:47  

We found a way,

 

Ryan Boelter  0:48  

just fine. Where there's a will.

 

Amelia Antrim  0:52  

There's the ability to survive Marvel. Exactly. We are collecting questions for a kind of belated anniversary q&a. If you've ever had anything you want to ask us about, about how we make the show, if you have questions about specific characters we've created or if you want our advice on something happening in your own game or with your own character, now is a great time to ask us put me on the spot asked me to name your character for you. Yeah, I don't know. You can submit the questions through our form, which you can find at questions dot character creation cast.com. But we can't make an episode if you don't give us questions. So please send them in.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:36  

Absolutely. I'm really looking forward to answering some of the questions that are already coming in. So get yours in too, because, goodness, it's gonna be a fun pile to sort

 

Amelia Antrim  1:47  

through, please. Yeah. I mean, we really want to read them. And we like answering them. And, you know, it doesn't have to be serious. It's okay.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:57  

I'd say about 70% of the questions are probably not serious.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:01  

I think a solid 25% of them are let's be mean to Amelia. So you, friends for? Yes, please send them in. You know if you've ever thought like, well, we don't really want to answer my question like, yes, we do. We do. Yes, we

 

Unknown Speaker  2:16  

do. We do.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:17  

Absolutely.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:18  

We do. I love telling people things. Like I love when people are like, What should I do? And I'm like, let me tell you about that. Yeah. So I mean, nothing would make me happier.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:30  

There you go. So so make me really happy and myself as well, because I like seeing people happy. So yeah. Speaking of USA versus Bed and Breakfast is still funding on Indiegogo for a little while longer. We mentioned last time that they are working on stretch goals to fund a heighth grant, which helps new designers, writers and artists break into the industry. It's really an awesome goal and a really, really great game. We'll have a link to the project in our show notes if you haven't checked it out yet.

 

Amelia Antrim  3:05  

Yes, please. It looks I just looks gorgeous. Like every time I see more like a an ad for it popped up on my Facebook recently. They had like a little video and everything. I was like, This is so good. It's so good.

 

Ryan Boelter  3:18  

That book is gonna be ginormous.

 

Amelia Antrim  3:20  

And you know, awful. I know I'm really excited to art is gorgeous. Yeah, absolutely. Pod chaser is doing their reviews for good campaign for the month of April. If you leave a review for a podcast on pod chaser this month, they'll donate 25 cents toward world central kitchen, which is helping to feed families in Ukraine. Very good cause if podcasters reply to your review, they'll double that amount. So if you haven't left us a review yet. Or if you left a review on a different platform, but not on pod chaser now would be an awesome time to do that. We will still read it on the show. Even if you left one somewhere else and you put one on purchase or now. We will read your review. So now's your chance people you can support charity. Yes. Even if you don't care about Ryan, I like if you don't care about our feelings and the fact that it makes us happy. At least you could feed some people.

 

Ryan Boelter  4:15  

Yeah, absolutely. And if you throw five stars away in meantime, you know, we won't be sad about that. Well, that's it for announcements. We actually kept it pretty short this week. Surprisingly, did

 

Amelia Antrim  4:29  

look at us being on task quite tired today,

 

Ryan Boelter  4:33  

so we're a little less silly. But that's okay. You know, you can join us after the episode for a call to action and a bonus outtakes. There's a few of them. So, stick around for that. But until then, enjoy the show.

 

Amelia Antrim  5:26  

Welcome back to our discussion episode. Last time we finished our session zero for Marvel Superheroes I think mostly Ryan, did you finish?

 

Ryan Boelter  5:36  

Maybe I

 

Amelia Antrim  5:40  

this episode we are going to discuss this character creation process. We are thrilled to welcome back Jeff and John from system mastery. Hello, would you like to reintroduce yourselves tell everybody about the characters you made?

 

Jef - System Mastery  5:55  

You go first.

 

Jon - System Mastery  5:57  

Hi, I'm John. Haha. I made a character and it's great. And I love him. Dearly sweet boy. Is sweet sweet Godfrey Godfrey. Sweet Godfrey. Halloween, the god of Halloween. AKA the treat Ranger.

 

Jef - System Mastery  6:15  

The treat Ranger the God of Halloween Godfrey Halloween, of man out of time, man just in time, a teenager a God. A God ager

 

Jon - System Mastery  6:25  

by God ager.

 

Amelia Antrim  6:27  

A guy with only kingsized candy bars.

 

Jon - System Mastery  6:31  

All the love and all

 

Jef - System Mastery  6:32  

the candy. And I made I made the trick Ranger Roger mortis. A Frankenstein, who summoned zombies and wrestles. And he was also it was oh, he's completely invincible. It's like it's like a completely impossible to hurt him. Except emotionally.

 

Amelia Antrim  6:49  

Well, cuz he's a teenager. So he's got

 

Jef - System Mastery  6:51  

psychological problems. And he hates religion, because he's an upstart, rebellious teenager and not because he's an undead monster.

 

Unknown Speaker  6:58  

Wow. For sure.

 

Jon - System Mastery  6:59  

Definitely not.

 

Amelia Antrim  7:00  

Ryan, why don't you tell us about your character board

 

Ryan Boelter  7:03  

character? Oh, goodness. This is probably the first character that I haven't really liked. But you know what? Okay, no,

 

Jef - System Mastery  7:11  

I am whose fault is that optimistic.

 

Ryan Boelter  7:12  

I know, I just figured out exactly what this character is all about. And I'm very excited to play it now. Okay, I made Casey spectrum Chase is spelt with a C to CS technically. And they are also known as the costume Ranger when they transform, because they can done multiple costumes. And they are a changeling. So that means they've got five count on five different physical forms that they could turn into. And that's where they got their first name from Chase. So it is a cyborg, with replacement limbs and organs. A humanoid robot, a altered chemistry type individual, another cyborg, but this time an exoskeleton and an ethereal form, which is a ghost. And they've got they've got all sorts of different a hodgepodge of powers because of course, and their biggest weakness is energy depletion. So they become incapacitated. From continuous contact with with with energy depletion stuff.

 

Jef - System Mastery  8:29  

You're just supposed to choose the type of energy Oh, where are you? Yeah, you're supposed to be like on contact with fire or something his power in your case, because you're all real body I would suggest like, you know, an electrical field or extreme heat or cold.

 

Ryan Boelter  8:43  

Ask me something ridiculous though, right?

 

Jef - System Mastery  8:46  

Yeah, it's probably should be like the dust from liquid

 

Ryan Boelter  8:49  

energy depletion, depleting energy from me or something like that.

 

Jef - System Mastery  8:55  

Guess what, I think energy depletion is the one where you can just run out of power.

 

Ryan Boelter  8:58  

Okay. Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  9:00  

My batteries are about Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yes.

 

Ryan Boelter  9:03  

So if my batteries get discharged enough, have a

 

Jon - System Mastery  9:09  

finite energy supply become a capacitor re up

 

Jef - System Mastery  9:13  

and it's a big Hopper strapped to your back. It's full of pixie sticks that shakes out the powder and keeps you moving where you eventually run out of pixie sticks.

 

Ryan Boelter  9:20  

I'm gonna read Ranger I'm gonna say it's like a like an EMP like electromagnetic pulse will just knock me out as long as that pulses going. But as soon as it turns off, then I'm I'm good. I'm back to normal school. Otherwise, I'm just on the ground. Even if I'm a ghost. So yeah, that was my fun character. Amelia. How about yourself?

 

Amelia Antrim  9:44  

Well, I made a robot that definitely doesn't look human at all. In fact, it looks like a giant spider. Which is why my name is sp one d3 R or the spider Ranger. Um I have like the worst lamest powers ever. Magic transferable so I can transfer my powers to other people. I have disintegration, but I'm not very good at it. That's a great album.

 

Jef - System Mastery  10:19  

Best cure albums.

 

Jon - System Mastery  10:22  

disintegration, and I can load it to be

 

Amelia Antrim  10:27  

exactly that's what it is right? And webcasting which obviously is probably a cable access show of some kind. Yeah. I am excited about the webcasting in my spider form. My weakness is energy allergy which I just I really need help deciding what kind of energy this allergy is.

 

Jef - System Mastery  10:50  

Yeah, it's people who aren't into Halloween. Yeah. I can't deal with your

 

Ryan Boelter  10:59  

former sneeze

 

Jef - System Mastery  11:00  

bad five you get really sick and weak If anyone gives you like a Chick tract instead of candy. Yep. Yeah, like chicken tree and they're like here's a handful of pennies in a in a book about the dangers of Dungeons and Dragons.

 

Amelia Antrim  11:14  

This is incapacitates me so

 

Jon - System Mastery  11:17  

yeah, I didn't mention my weakness. Godfrey Halloween has a psychological weakness to pastels. Yes, that's right. Just negates his ability to use powers so none of his powers work on anything. Pesta Oh, no.

 

Jef - System Mastery  11:30  

And Rogers weaknesses holy symbols. It was picked for him by being undead. But in his case, it's just that it causes him to go on a long tirade about how none of that that how religion is all bold because he's a little a little high school boy. He's edgy. Yeah, he's always too edgy for you. I like to assume that even though he's a Frankenstein he dresses in like a Pantera jacket. I love it a letterman jacket.

 

Jon - System Mastery  11:54  

I love it. Yeah, absolutely. And terror shirt under the Letterman. There you go.

 

Jef - System Mastery  11:57  

Yeah. Total metalhead. Frankenstein. Monster. There's just been his name.

 

Jon - System Mastery  12:01  

Yeah, if he was a regular hero and not a Sentai hero, you would have been

 

Jef - System Mastery  12:05  

total metalhead Frankenstein the totals part of it?

 

Ryan Boelter  12:10  

Ah, well, I'm excited to discuss this game, because I've got I've got a few thoughts about it.

 

Jon - System Mastery  12:17  

Do you? Does your experience give you some thoughts? I love it. Let's go

 

Ryan Boelter  12:23  

ahead and dive right into a segment we're calling D 20. For your thoughts. b 20,

 

Unknown Speaker  12:27  

for your thoughts.

 

Amelia Antrim  12:28  

So in this segment, we talk to our guests about their thoughts on the character creation process, how long it takes compared to other games we've played? We usually start with our getting to know your questions. But we've we've asked you those already. Because you've been on our show before.

 

Ryan Boelter  12:47  

Yeah, you've been through two iterations ever getting questions?

 

Amelia Antrim  12:51  

Yeah. So So our question this time is what What draws you to these old bad games?

 

Jon - System Mastery  12:59  

Your question is,

 

Amelia Antrim  13:00  

what's your life's work? Why?

 

Jef - System Mastery  13:06  

Oh, I think we I think among most people in the world, we have the highest ROI on purchasing a bad game. Yeah. When most people purchase an old bad game from the 80s. They are going to keep it on their shelf for a while, make no money from it, and then have to throw it away shamefully, later, where when we purchase one, it turns into a giant Patreon and money. That's fair. So we are we are entirely mercenary about all of that. I'm kidding. We have real reasons. It's Yeah, we

 

Jon - System Mastery  13:37  

love bad things and reveling in them. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  13:40  

both of us have a shared personality trait of wanting to wallow in dumb nonsense and kind of point and laugh at it. Yeah. Which has led to everything that we do for the shows we everything that we are as people we are we find the worst role playing games, we let people tell us what the worst movies are. We read Star Wars novels that are rightfully not legal anymore. We're friends with the worst people. We're the we're the worst possible network. We worked hard to find it. But yeah, that's that's just our thing. We just like finding old bet that the to me, the truth of the matter is, for as much as we like reading these and making fun of them, we don't play them.

 

Amelia Antrim  14:21  

Right. Right, you have the same thing that we do is the like, we don't have to follow through on any of Yeah, we just get to like enjoy the garbage parts for the garbage that they are and then walk away.

 

Jon - System Mastery  14:33  

I just I think when we started it, it was like, Oh, just because we know about RPGs. And that's one of the things that we know about. Yes. But honestly, through the years of doing this, it has become such an interesting, delve into the way that all of these different mechanics work and how different eras had different ideas about things.

 

Jef - System Mastery  14:55  

And we definitely hit a point where we can read like the first three pages of a book and then just be like

 

Jon - System Mastery  15:00  

So this came out at about what 94? Six.

 

Jef - System Mastery  15:04  

Okay, deep detail enroll understand plus skill.

 

Amelia Antrim  15:07  

Yeah, I was wondering, I always wonder about that when I listened to your show, too is like, how much have you gleaned about, you know, like the way that like, you're almost unofficial historians at this point of like this whole, you know, like growth and change over time.

 

Jon - System Mastery  15:24  

Yeah, it's weird that I feel like, when it comes to specifics, if you were like, tell me, you know, what were the mechanics of this specific game that you reviewed? It unless it was one that really stuck out? I'd be like, I don't do that. When it comes to the gestalt of it, I'm like, oh, yeah, I've retained so much information on trends that happen, the way that various ideas of how to roll or what you should be rolling, and what a character is, and what they should be doing has changed and evolved over the years. And it's so interesting. One of

 

Jef - System Mastery  16:03  

the things I think we both picked up a talent for is we can read a book, like from the intro, if we were just the just the intro section, I guarantee you will will be able to tell you what decade that was. If you give us the skill section two, we usually can get the year within one or two. Yeah. Because it's just the trends are so noticeable over time.

 

Amelia Antrim  16:22  

So here's a question too. I've I've always wanted to ask, is there a thing? Like a trend in games? Yeah, great. That we've moved away from that. You think that we should go back to that you wish modern games had

 

Jon - System Mastery  16:39  

more tables? God bless them. But modern design does not want the random tables? Yeah, as much as I do. Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  16:47  

There are certain things that I would say I like about old games. I don't know that they need to come back. But I'm glad that they are there where they are. Yeah, one of them is we talked about in the main episode was chummy, asides, that kind of like you feel like you're connected to the author a little more. That stuff's all gone and modern games unless they're OSR. Because OSR is kind of still the world of a person person's passion projects, passion projects. And so they'll happily insert a paragraph. That's just them saying, I think games should be played in the following manner. But I liked that in old games, where there wasn't as much editorial streamlining, and so you just found weird things when you're reading them. And even if they weren't good, it was fun.

 

Amelia Antrim  17:25  

Yeah, I definitely think random tables should be more prevalent. I know, I've seen especially with like any submissions and stuff, like more and more like our supplement books that have random tables in them to go along with your game. And it was like, Well, if you put them in your game, then we wouldn't need a whole separate books of random tables. A book

 

Jef - System Mastery  17:47  

that's killing the small market, that little dead market of folks selling 99 said books that are just 1000 cars or whatever,

 

Amelia Antrim  17:54  

right? Yeah, I see. And I'm a sucker for those. So absolutely. loves them. Yeah.

 

Jon - System Mastery  17:58  

What does I love the more modern trend towards more narrative control over who you are, and what you do and less about, like, Oh, you have this power. And it's got this number. You know, when you have things that are like fate, or PVTA are things where it's much more about the words than the numbers. I see how the random tables get put by the sidelines. But God, there's just something about rolling on a bunch of tables, taking this disparate pile of random nonsense and going, how do I turn this into a thing? Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  18:38  

right. Yeah, no satisfy any kind of sense at all?

 

Ryan Boelter  18:42  

Yeah, like I can, I think there's no, I can see, like taking these tables in in the stuff that we just did in the last couple of episodes. And just getting to that point where you know, the names of the powers, but you have zero information in the book about what that means. And then you get to define that right for a narrative sort of system.

 

Jef - System Mastery  19:03  

Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, granted, their definitions are all there in the book if you want them, but you can also skip that part and just use it as a jumping off point. Yeah. Right. Which I'm a fan of what I like in random tables is when they provide basically improv prompts. Yeah. And for me that that means they have to be both challenging and wildly different. Because, you know, you look at some of the oldest tables from like, AD D, and so on like that one. That's just like, what type of strumpet did you encounter? Like, ah, I encountered a tempestuous trumpet and a wanton Doxy. And you're just like, I don't know what that means. And even if it wouldn't be that difficult, this is not worth the random table. But in terms of role playing challenges, I love random tables.

 

Unknown Speaker  19:43  

Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  19:44  

Yeah. They're so good.

 

Ryan Boelter  19:46  

Mm hmm. So what sort of lessons do you think we can get from examining these older games? Like do you think it can help us avoid some of the common pitfalls that that were prevalent in a lot of those earlier eras?

 

Jef - System Mastery  19:59  

I mean, absolute Really, as we talked about, there are a number of things we talked about that we see disappearing and dying over the course of history of role playing game design, usually for the better. The the snooty paragraph about how they're going to use the key pronoun throughout this, as Webster's defines, has started to go away. And that's nice.

 

Jon - System Mastery  20:21  

Yeah, there's, I mean, just certain things like the seduction skill being more inclusive, The later you get or just not existing. Yes.

 

Jef - System Mastery  20:32  

We talked about that one quite a bit on the show that there's, there's a trend in, in designing role playing games to pad the skill section out by defining all these commonly understood words. Like I have a skill in climbing. And then after that, it goes like climbing is the vertical ascent or descent of a surface using tools or perhaps freestyle? Like, why would you put this in here? I didn't, this is a dictionary. But notably, it leads to people shooting themselves in the foot a lot, because if you listen to our show, not enough, you know, I'm always pissed off by seduction. This is the art of attempting to engender a sexual liaison with a member of the opposite sex. And I'm always like, why do that to yourself? Why limited like that when you don't even have to when you could just put seduction, the skill of seducing people and left it at that, right. But no, there's there's there's a ton to learn. We've learned over the years that maybe the DND stat set isn't the most important thing in the world, and we don't need to apply it to every game.

 

Amelia Antrim  21:27  

Yeah, shocked.

 

Jon - System Mastery  21:29  

There's so many things in these old games that we ended up coming out and be like, alright, well, you know, writing advice, try to avoid certain pitfalls, as far as, you know, putting on the necessary information, breaking up necessary information, like if you're in the middle of character creation, or a combat section, or how to do something and you're like, add now a timeline and you're like, I don't need this right now. That's stopping

 

Jef - System Mastery  21:58  

the 100,000 year timeline, most of which is nonsense words that don't show up ever again. Yeah. The grumblings invaders, the dirt Flynn do either of those exist anymore. No, that happened 130,000 years ago.

 

Amelia Antrim  22:14  

Those playable character types?

 

Ryan Boelter  22:15  

Well, what if you're gonna be a historian in this world?

 

Jef - System Mastery  22:18  

I guess that's definitely put that at the very front of the book. Yep.

 

Amelia Antrim  22:22  

In the middle of the character creation section. Yeah. Absolutely. No, there's

 

Jef - System Mastery  22:26  

there's, there's so many lessons to be learned from reading old games. We have a lot of listeners who are designers. And that's really the number one reason they came to the show is because we spend a lot of time on what not to do and how and when dem advice is bad, which is surprisingly common, because one of the things that shifts over the years is the relationship between the DM and the player. Is that a lot less adversarial? Yes. And a lot less imperious. Like, if you look at really old d&d, you have things like, there's only one person at the table who was allowed to talk to the DM. Yeah, you have the last shot? Caller. Yeah. Well, in the earliest days, there were formalized roles among players at the table. You had the shot caller whose job it was to gather all the PC input, revise it to their liking, and then present it to the DM, why, and then the DM woodenly feud.

 

Jef - System Mastery  23:25  

I mean, we're talking about an era where Gygax pretty famously would occasionally play behind like opened cabinet doors, so no one can see his face. Yeah. And would only respond to the caller. Well, yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  23:37  

it was, there is

 

Amelia Antrim  23:38  

more peaceful friends with him.

 

Jon - System Mastery  23:43  

Because there was a an idea that the person running the game wasn't a player, you weren't playing a game, you were being in charge of things. It's like the difference between a director and an actor. Whereas nowadays, it's much more like, Oh, we're all just

 

Amelia Antrim  24:02  

this is another.

 

Ryan Boelter  24:03  

Yeah. So DM was basically a human computer that would accept input and push output. And theoretically, like, you know, makes a game

 

Jon - System Mastery  24:15  

say that your character died. It's

 

Jef - System Mastery  24:17  

nice, because we've seen that role evolve over decades where it moved from in the 70s. It was like the DM isn't even a person you're allowed to talk to, or look at. They're just a person who exists at the table into the 80s, where the DM is like a gnomic God figure who you're not you don't want to arouse their ire or they'll kill you with a flying cow into the 90s, where they're still really important, but they are treated with that degree of crazy reverence. And then by the time you hit the 2000s, you start seeing GM lose games and games where you pass the DM or GM responsibility. It's definitely a thing that has evolved over time because honestly, I my personal opinion, it's because the the player base has gotten younger over the years. The whole thing of wanting to be pretend like the DM has everybody at the tables dad has kind of Yeah, got started to feel silly when no one at the table is dad age.

 

Amelia Antrim  25:09  

I think too, it's you know, just the fact that we have like a whole different, like type of person to playing that like we've we've opened up games like I think about, you know, like if Gygax was like a terrible DM like, I'm like, I wouldn't have even been invited into those games anyway. So like, I don't know why I'm so mad about them. Like, you know, it's there's a literal democracy to it that just wasn't there before.

 

Jef - System Mastery  25:35  

I can totally see why people would be mad about that. No one likes hearing about what the original history of d&d is. Because it's so contrary to what the kind of established positions about what d&d is like, Oh, this game shouldn't be a miniatures game It never was before. And it's like, no, it's an outgrowth, based on a miniatures game called chainmail is the first thing that d&d ever was. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  25:57  

There's a lot of that, I think, in the history of games that was like it was never like this. It's like, actually, it was like, This is not how games were meant to be really, because they were like that for like, 30 years.

 

Jef - System Mastery  26:07  

Yeah. That's our job to be burdened with the terrible knowledge of the truth.

 

Amelia Antrim  26:13  

Speaking of terrible knowledge of the truth, yeah. How do you think character creation in this game stacks up to other games? I. So we talked a lot about heroes Unlimited, because that was another random rolling superhero game. And actually, sentinels was two, we did a lot of random rolling in that one in this for some reason, Ryan, I don't know why this one. This one, I

 

Ryan Boelter  26:38  

don't know why this you had to make five characters, I did have to make five characters at once. And there was some things that were a little confusing, and, and it was three columns of weird font that I had a hard time kind of following that points, especially when you have tables that split into different sections. And you have to kind of go back and forth there was there was a lot going on.

 

Amelia Antrim  27:03  

I see this felt like almost the same as heroes unlimited to me, I think you're just not as familiar with it. I think that's the difference. I want to

 

Jef - System Mastery  27:10  

point out one thing about that they came out the same year. Oh, that hurts. I mean, technically both. Both games had their first please. We we reviewed revised editions of both games. Yeah, both heroes unlimited. And Marvel Superheroes role playing both came out in 84. Okay, and then the revised editions came out in 86, and 87, respectively. So the reason they feel so similar, is because they're from roughly the exact same era of RPG superhero game design, I

 

Ryan Boelter  27:34  

can see this, I can see the similarity easily there. And this one feels a little more complex overall. Like if we, if we were, if we were to dive into like the component, creation, or whatever you were talking about with that with the robotics and whatnot, then I can see it being a little bit even more complex at that point,

 

Jef - System Mastery  27:57  

they both have, this is the thing I find in ad's design, which is that they every time you look close to the small piece of the game, it fractals out into a whole new sub system that uses its own rules. Like if you just just take robot design, if you build a robot in this game, you have to go to this whole robot subsection, you start where you're not given a budget, because this game doesn't use real money. But instead, you're gonna you're gonna start building a robot with like, parts and with tools with a whole new toolkit that's not connected to the powers engine. We're in Heroes unlimited. If you're old robot, you are given in a budget in the millions of dollars. And you used an entire new purchasing subsystem to build your character.

 

Amelia Antrim  28:35  

A totally different system for like picking magic stuff to

 

Jef - System Mastery  28:38  

Yep, I'm sure did. And this game is the same thing. The these games both come from an era where subsystem it was encouraged that subsystems should be whole new game engines. As opposed to a more modern take on everything being kind of using the same rules and just changing the flavor around a little bit.

 

Ryan Boelter  28:56  

I wouldn't be really interested to see how this game actually plays. I would not

 

Jef - System Mastery  29:05  

say for once you get used to that big dumb periodic table resolution chart that's not super complicated. Because you're always just like, the initiative is just roll against your agility. The, the, the you just treat your agility as you're ranked number and roll and see where you get and then you go in order. And then attacks are just like I will shoot a beam at that guy. I roll. It says like I cut cross reference my chart because it was remarkable beam shot. It does 56 damage. What is your response? And they go I have body armor that absorbs the first 34 damage?

 

Ryan Boelter  29:36  

Yeah. Gaming numbers in the combat and all that sort of stuff. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  29:41  

yeah. And there's also defenses and what defenses do is they inflict a negative column shift on the attacking player. So you'll say things like I shoot you I got a incredible result. So it's 36 damage and they go actually, because of my force field. I'm going to call them shift that down to the left. So you have to get that that result. And then you look at that part of the chart. go okay, it's That is hitting you for 36. I hit you for 12. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  30:03  

And I do think that like, as annoying as it is to have like that giant chart, that column shift, honestly is a lot easier than remembering. It's like a minus 10 to the damage over three turns plus, like it's easier to remember the numbers.

 

Jon - System Mastery  30:17  

Yeah, if you're willing to have that chart open, if you are willing to have that as a conceit of yeah, this needs to have this chart open, then it ends up being mostly fine. As far as learning goes. Yeah, and I mean, even as far as making characters, we did use an ultimate powers book that made it way more complicated than it normally is fair, there are several dozen versions of like, what your physical form is, whereas normally there are five in the main book. And one big thing is that if you're using just the five versions, you are significantly more likely to end up being told to make a robot power suit or something. This one, you're almost always just going to generate someone who's got like five superpowers. Yeah, so you get your powers are wild and weird. And it takes longer to get used to what they are, but at least you aren't more likely to be forced to engage someone of the archaic subsystems.

 

Amelia Antrim  31:09  

That make sense. Yeah. And also you could have just not been exchanging.

 

Ryan Boelter  31:14  

That's 100%. True.

 

Amelia Antrim  31:16  

I also I honestly, I think that like if you were sitting at home and doing it and not feeling rush, yeah, it might have been different, too. Because you're sitting around with all of us. We're all done. Yeah, you're still going and watching the time of like, okay, I have to edit all of this.

 

Ryan Boelter  31:33  

Literally was in my mind as

 

Amelia Antrim  31:36  

night to do it. I think maybe it wouldn't have been as annoying. Yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  31:39  

exactly. Think about it was pretty straightforward. As a process, technically, right?

 

Unknown Speaker  31:45  

Yeah, it was a lot.

 

Jon - System Mastery  31:47  

Think about if you were like, Oh, I have to make five heroes, unlimited characters, and one of them's a sideboard, and one of them? And

 

Ryan Boelter  31:57  

some stuff to do, that would be worse.

 

Jon - System Mastery  32:00  

Yeah, it's not exactly that this was, you know, oh, the systems themselves are particularly complex. It's just, you had to do all of the systems

 

Amelia Antrim  32:10  

to write down far fewer numbers.

 

Jef - System Mastery  32:14  

Basically, in terms of 80s TSR. This is a very streamlined, straightforward and easy to use system. Yeah.

 

Ryan Boelter  32:21  

Okay. So I'm gonna step back from my brain breakage a little bit and get a little bit more objective here. I did kind of enjoy the face rip thing, where you've got your seven attributes, and it was, it was so different from rolling 3d Six, and applying that two things, it was your all a percentage on one of these five charts. And then one of those is going to be like, your, your attribute name. It was so different from, like, traditional systems, that that it, it was a little satisfying, in a way. Yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  33:02  

I mean, the, the way that you make the character in the game, having just a column, usually, the thing is where you'd normally just look at one, you wouldn't have to worry about all of them, right? You know, if you're just making one regular character, you're like, Alright, I just do seven roles on this one column, I write down the name and number for those. That's great. And then you move on and up. And yeah, you'll you know, you're like, alright, I'll add the numbers from here. I'll add the numbers from here.

 

Jef - System Mastery  33:37  

Done. Yeah. The one nice thing about this game is it is so random, every aspect can be randomly rolled, is that there are a plethora of available character, creating engines, like I've got one in front of me right now where I can press one button, and it just spits out an entire new character. Yeah, yeah. Using all the rules that we just used. Yeah. So I can be like, Oh, look, I made a sort of cyborg with artificial limbs and organs and you can animate drawings and turn himself into a vegetable and he has

 

Ryan Boelter  34:05  

a good character generator. But that's pretty amazing though, because it when I guess when you think about it, it is very pro grammatical. How you can create characters in the system. It's literally go to a bunch of tables and work your way through the tree of options. And now you have a character, which is very indicative of those old ad style games, where if it's more of what can your person do, then who is your person?

 

Jon - System Mastery  34:37  

The we also using the ultimate powers book ended up having way more nonsense because it's the same way to make a character in the main book, you roll for a category and then you random roll for a power within that category. Yeah. But all of the categories have, you know, a A handful of things like your rolling a D 10, on your power roll. And for some of them, they don't even have 10 powers. Like they'll just have multiple numbers for one of them. Like the matter control is basically just the various elements. And then you can get something like weather control, which doesn't do anything.

 

Jef - System Mastery  35:20  

Oh, definitely. Yes, weather control does. It's one of the worst written power book. So we talked about, we didn't talk about this very much, we hinted at it in the character creation rules. But one of the ways that you can develop your character in this game is through power stunts. And as an easy example of a power stunt, let's just take the fastball special when Colossus picks up Wolverine and throws him and Wolverine flashes targets faster, because he got thrown even though it's kind of silly that that that works at all. To do something like that, because ultimately, between Colossus is super strength and Wolverines claws, there's nothing like the fastball special directly, they had to make that up and try it. When this happens, to to make this happen, you have to spend 100 karma, which I don't think a single one of us had 100 karma to start, I did, Okay, God, right. You get to spend 100 karma, you have to make an incredible difficulty to test it to attempt to do the thing. And if you succeed at that, then you do that that power is done once. And if you would like that power start to become a permanent part of your repertoire, you have to do the exact same power stop and spend 100 karma and succeeded it 10 times in a row. Oh, wow, this just becomes a thing you can do. Now, weather control to get back to the core point weather control is a power. They were like this power is universally very powerful. Because you've seen what storm can do. She can just do anything with weather control. She can make ice cubes in the glass for some reason it works in space for some reason. Well, to balance the fact that it seems like it's overwhelmingly powerful, it starts doing nothing. And if you want it to do anything, that's power stunts. Yeah.

 

Unknown Speaker  36:55  

Oh wow.

 

Jon - System Mastery  36:56  

You can basically duplicate any other power that you can argue yourself into. But you have to spend 100 karma and do a power stunt to do it.

 

Amelia Antrim  37:08  

Why not just start it out with like one type of weather being like only rain

 

Jon - System Mastery  37:12  

we would have done that is literally in our episode what I was like why why do you not just be like I can make my power?

 

Amelia Antrim  37:22  

Like why would lead me to wonder this thing

 

Jef - System Mastery  37:25  

how it made me wonder how long until storms career did she take did it take for her to realize she's a mutant cuz she was bored with like, weather control that development. She was 13. But it didn't do anything. Right. He had to be like, I wonder if I could make it halo around here 10 times in a row and get lucky on the roll. You

 

Ryan Boelter  37:41  

have to do so much like things to get karma before you can actually like even think you can do things like that.

 

Amelia Antrim  37:49  

Forget, like sharing your karma and somebody accidentally killing somebody.

 

Jon - System Mastery  37:53  

And let me just say that storm started out her life as a pickpocket. So definitely not getting much karma losing a whole lot of it.

 

Ryan Boelter  38:01  

At least she wasn't, you know, killing people and going down to zero.

 

Jon - System Mastery  38:06  

Well, no, you weren't going to zero but she was definitely losing like 50 to 100 every time she was stealing. Oh,

 

Jef - System Mastery  38:11  

yeah. So she, she had zero out eventually. Anyway, wow. It does lead to the morality that was injected into the system and the Power Stone stuff leads unfortunately, away from something that looks like Marvel, where you'd have characters like the Punisher, who kills indiscriminately, or like Storm who could do all kinds of things with weather control and didn't have a period where she couldn't. Yeah, like the moment she had weather control. She's like, Oh, okay, I know, I have weather control watches. I make it lightning over there and snow over there. Yeah. There was never a point in her story where she was like, I can make some wind sometimes.

 

Amelia Antrim  38:45  

Yeah, I think that that's like a continuous problem, though, with like, when we start to like gamify fiction, is that like, the idea that we need to balance things? And it's like, well, that's not how the stories work. And it just, you can't, you can't mechanize some of these story points, you just can't, right, it feels really weird.

 

Jef - System Mastery  39:05  

Part of it is adding failed chances is what's killing that. If you look at a more modern superhero game, like masks or sentinels, your power will go off even if it doesn't do very much. You have your powers and you can use them and they do do stuff and you can't interact with the world with them. Even if you fail with the application.

 

Amelia Antrim  39:23  

What the consequences of doing that are,

 

Jef - System Mastery  39:25  

yes, they split the conflict consequence from this weird binary if something happens or nothing happens to, you know, you disinfect goes to

 

Jon - System Mastery  39:33  

lunch. Yes.

 

Ryan Boelter  39:36  

Yeah, absolutely. And it's wild in a game where you can have such a power disparity off the bat, that they even cared at all about balance.

 

Jon - System Mastery  39:48  

Yeah. I mean, there was always this idea that we wanted to try and balance things that existed at the time, but also, they were like, but we need to account for the fact that, especially in something like a superhero game, they're like, Yeah, but we have to be able to make everyone from, you know, daredevil up to Superman. And so they're like, well, we'll just make it a small chance that someone becomes Superman. But if one of your players at the table is like, Hey, I rolled the 100. I'm Superman, then everyone else at the table gets to go. Oh, oh, okay.

 

Ryan Boelter  40:25  

Oh, goodness. What a game though. Oh, yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  40:28  

I spent so much time while you were making your character, trying to find the rules for how many actions you could take and around? Oh, because I at first looked at dodging, because I was like, Oh, I have Shift X agility. Like, if I want to dodge something, it's really easy. But I was like, Alright, what's dodging do and they're like, oh, dodging if you try and dodge, then depending on what you roll on your feet table, you'll shift your column shift down anyone else's roll to try and hit you. I'm like, Cool, great. And then it also says, and you can only take one more action in a turn no matter what. And I went, Okay, but how many actions do I take? Right? And then that got me in a rabbit hole of slay? Why do they have any information about anything here?

 

Ryan Boelter  41:18  

There's got to be only one action per round, right? At that point is

 

Jon - System Mastery  41:23  

one action, per person baseline. And you can roll a feat to try and get more actions. While so if you're like, Alright, I want to do more than one thing, then you're like, great. You have to roll a like agility thing at, depending on how many actions you're taking, like various columns shifts down. It's a, it's an interesting idea. And I was like, You should probably have just decided it was one and just leave it at one. Yeah. So wild. I mean, the one thing I'm happy about is they didn't do the mistake that so many games have done and honestly even continue to do, which is the action advantage thing, where you're like, Oh, your number of actions is tied to one of your stats, which means if you screwed that stat up, you don't get to do as much. Thankfully, that is not it.

 

Ryan Boelter  42:21  

I'm just glad I had five chances to have my stats. Somewhat, like usable. Yeah. And it turns out one of my Farms is actually not bad.

 

Unknown Speaker  42:33  

Or is it? No.

 

Ryan Boelter  42:36  

No, my cyborg exit exoskeleton is fantastic. Comparatively, is the one that can generate fire?

 

Unknown Speaker  42:45  

Ooh, fire. hot fire.

 

Ryan Boelter  42:49  

So how does the process of character creation in this game reinforce the feel of this game? Instead expectations for play? Or does it badly?

 

Amelia Antrim  43:03  

Like, unless there's a lot of rolling on random tables

 

Jef - System Mastery  43:07  

arise that that is there definitely is you're

 

Ryan Boelter  43:09  

rolling percentiles a lot, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  43:13  

you definitely learn the basic mechanics of the game, because the language of the game is is shared across all the aspects. So you know, not only do you have incredible strength or whatever, but you do you do an incredible damage results on the on the chart to see how much damage you do when you try. Are you getting a remarkable when you're trying to overcome a challenge? So you at least learned the language of the game is consistent

 

Amelia Antrim  43:38  

in those key words. But I've been

 

Jef - System Mastery  43:41  

playing this game for nearly 30 years, or at least know aware of it and playing it intermittently. And I still don't remember the order of the words.

 

Ryan Boelter  43:48  

Yeah, I would argue there's no face rip, like acronym that you can use for? Yep, that that is really bad. Yeah, I'd

 

Jef - System Mastery  43:59  

be like for putting Fuka to good.

 

Amelia Antrim  44:06  

Other than, like, poor or typical, the rest of them are, like all variations on you know, it's like excellent, amazing. Like,

 

Jef - System Mastery  44:14  

honestly. Yeah. If

 

Jon - System Mastery  44:15  

you're like, what, what's better, amazing or incredibly? I don't know, man.

 

Jef - System Mastery  44:21  

Yeah, it's just, it's a thing that you see from time to time in games that try to replace numbers with words because I think it's more immersive.

 

Jon - System Mastery  44:28  

Or usually the difficulty chart where they're like, Ah, this is difficult. But this is hard. And I'm not going to remember which one is which. What's the difference between this being puzzling versus this being challenging? Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  44:42  

good. Excellent. Remarkable. Amazing. Like, yeah, I could never remember what order those are like. No, yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  44:49  

Yeah. So that's, that's not great. No, it's excellent. They really should be, actually,

 

Ryan Boelter  44:56  

it should be. Something easy to remember. Ah, Um, yeah. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  45:02  

It should have been Marvel gig Susie.

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:04  

Mirjam Bagram miserable average remarkable that something for V.

 

Jon - System Mastery  45:12  

Very good

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:15  

excellent and legend legendary sees

 

Amelia Antrim  45:22  

you as a really misunderstanding is

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:23  

that the new game to be coming out features what they're calling the D 616. System?

 

Amelia Antrim  45:28  

Oh yes, I saw that because

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:30  

it's got something to do with these euros 616.

 

Jon - System Mastery  45:32  

Guys,

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:33  

I think it's your role to D six and keep one or so there's a it's a QC thing. What was it?

 

Ryan Boelter  45:39  

616 supposed to be like one of the universes or something like that's the main continuity?

 

Amelia Antrim  45:44  

Yeah, that's the Yeah, it bothered me. I was like, you're trying too hard.

 

Jef - System Mastery  45:53  

Oh, I'm just glad that didn't name it after the MCU is universe number, which I think is 19999990

 

Jon - System Mastery  46:00  

be hard to say I can't remember what the actual number is for it.

 

Jef - System Mastery  46:05  

Wow. Oh, they've been downplaying its existence. They appoint a guy named they like the comic book company was like, Yeah, we know the universe for the number for the MCU. And then the people at the Marvel studios were like, Yeah, we don't want that to be a thing that exists. We don't want

 

Jon - System Mastery  46:19  

people to have to be like, what's that? 199999? Did I say enough? Nine, this one and five

 

Unknown Speaker  46:25  

nines? Wow, that's no

 

Jon - System Mastery  46:28  

9099 99.

 

Amelia Antrim  46:31  

That's one of the things we like to do is look at the character sheets too, and see what it can tell us about playing the game and about what kind of things are going to be important in the game? How do we feel like these character sheets do that?

 

Jon - System Mastery  46:51  

I would say one of the more interesting things about the character sheets in this, especially in the phase rip section for your abilities is it feels like the game is going to be more about growth than it actually is given that you're like, here's my initial rank. Here's what it is currently. Here's my role, like so you can see the progression of where you're going. But the amount of points it takes to grow is so much that and the heavy hitters in the way. Yeah, it feels like this is lying to me about how much I'm going to get better. Yes,

 

Jef - System Mastery  47:30  

I think that's part of what our read throughs because we like I said, we tried to do this as a pilot episode. And then we came back later and did it as our 200th episode. And it's been forever since I've been able to listen to the pilot is on like four computers ago. We were largely positive on the game, because we didn't know any better back then. But then when we came back and read it again for episode 200 We were like, Oh no, this game has so many bad lessons on Play

 

Jon - System Mastery  47:55  

doubly bad.

 

Amelia Antrim  47:58  

I have to say one. There are not that many lines to write your powers.

 

Unknown Speaker  48:03  

Oh, or to write any

 

Jon - System Mastery  48:05  

base game they give up the powers supplement that's true are going to have between two and five. That's it. And if you're looking at getting double powers powers that take up two slots, you can have one Yeah, that's true. That's true.

 

Jef - System Mastery  48:21  

It's endlessly amusing to me that the ultimate powers guy came out and was like what if we just tripled the amount of powers everyone had? Yeah, that mess with the balance or anything?

 

Jon - System Mastery  48:30  

No, because you'll all be rolling things like battery was this I can charge my energy up does that do nothing? Poor battery?

 

Jef - System Mastery  48:41  

Yeah, there's a lot of powers of the ultimate powers guide that don't do much. Which is I'm pretty sure why they gave you so many extras. So you can have all these powers like Gestalt and Nemesis and trouble seeker that don't have any really strong effect on a combat instead just sort of mess with you. Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  48:56  

yeah, the other thing is that you have the primary abilities like your face rip and the spots to write everything and then you go over to the Secondary Abilities and those boxes are equally big and I only had to write like one thing in there instead is weird six or seven? That bothered me it's like this box I just put 10 But this one I have to write incredible incredible incredible like I have to you know like they don't fit it just poorly like laid out

 

Jef - System Mastery  49:25  

Yeah, well it's it is a very old character sheet and yeah, you can tell the the layout is not great. One nice thing about this game is that there are so many player created character sheets so beloved, that people put way too much time into making stuff is what 3038 years old. So there's been plenty of room to get in there and mess with it.

 

Amelia Antrim  49:46  

Oh, I was like that's not that's not that. And then I was like, How old am I? Oh, that's a bummer.

 

Ryan Boelter  49:54  

Oh, yeah. It's interesting because like, you know, this this definitely does not account for a changeling for sure. I mean, I literally would have to take five character sheets and staple them together to make my character effectively,

 

Unknown Speaker  50:13  

right small.

 

Amelia Antrim  50:15  

I do kind of different colors.

 

Jon - System Mastery  50:19  

I wish the ultimate powers book came with a new character. She really should have had that book in mind. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  50:25  

well, the the changeling is it'd be very hard to it's only the 100 on the D 100. Chuck Yeah, supposed to get it all that often. And it I think it even towards you in the changeling section like, Look, you might want to roll something else. You're just gonna be here all day. That many characters in the Marvel Universe that have to relevant combat forms? Yeah. Because it's not you can always be like, my character is a changeling because he's Bruce Banner. And sometimes he's the incredible holy, but I don't really need to know banner stats.

 

Ryan Boelter  50:53  

Yeah, exactly. Because he's not going to do much.

 

Jef - System Mastery  50:56  

But in terms of characters who are like, well, I can switch between one combat form and another combat form. Those are fairly rare, but not unheard of. I can probably think of one or two, but they are fairly rare.

 

Ryan Boelter  51:09  

Yeah. Usually you're looking at shapeshifters. Yeah, and I don't even know why they've got an option for five. That seems like overkill.

 

Jef - System Mastery  51:18  

It's too many. Yeah, I mean, I don't even know who that's specifically for. It's got to be someone who can not only copy people, but their powers as well. Notably, the cover of the ultimate powers Guide is a 80s list of characters who had multiple other characters powers. And they're so obscure that I can only name like, four of the five of them and that's being generous. Yeah, I

 

Jon - System Mastery  51:39  

was gonna say well, there's mimic and super scrolling Warlock on there. The guy

 

Jef - System Mastery  51:42  

in the front is Nemesis and I have no idea who Colossus Nightcrawler Mystique Rogue is yeah, I've no idea who that is.

 

Unknown Speaker  51:52  

That is wild. Yeah. Oh, goodness.

 

Jef - System Mastery  51:56  

But yeah, that's that's your little the all of those characters, though. Aren't form shifters. Their power copiers. Yeah. And some of them are compounds. Like super scroll is the compound. He has the powers of the Fantastic Four all the time.

 

Unknown Speaker  52:09  

Oh, interesting. Yeah. Anyway,

 

Jef - System Mastery  52:13  

that's off on a tangent. I just find the cover of this book. Amazing, because they were like, Yeah, you can put some characters that I guarantee you no one knows who they are. Yes, the 80s. And we're making role playing games. There's no rules. Exactly. I read on the cover and sell this book. Oh, you could put the foot you put a weird green bug tentacle or bug intended Captain America on the front.

 

Jon - System Mastery  52:39  

You know, Captain America and also Hawkeye. Maybe?

 

Amelia Antrim  52:42  

Captain mantis? And I don't know why you don't know that.

 

Unknown Speaker  52:47  

It's Domantas Ah, I'll take it so good. So there's problem

 

Amelia Antrim  52:54  

looking really close it's it's just like why is like one like an extra from The Lion King on Broadway. It's just

 

Jon - System Mastery  53:04  

God bless you Warlock

 

Jef - System Mastery  53:06  

Warlocks a robot and he couldn't copy the powers of other people. That's his deal. Yeah.

 

Jon - System Mastery  53:11  

Maybe can copy up to five mutant powers at a time.

 

Jef - System Mastery  53:16  

Super scroll is the Fantastic Four. And I'm kind of wondering if that guy in the front isn't early isn't an early version of taskmaster?

 

Jon - System Mastery  53:24  

I don't know. Because it's definitely the Iron Man shoulder and chest bits. The Hawkeye face mask and boots. And then the Captain America shield and shirt and no

 

Jef - System Mastery  53:37  

first appearance of taskmaster. He already had that outfit. I no idea. I have no idea who that is. I think maybe Ant Man helmet. Yeah, he's just a mix of the current events. He's just an avenger of his even green for the Hulk

 

Ryan Boelter  53:49  

has wild, amazing range.

 

Jon - System Mastery  53:51  

No idea.

 

Amelia Antrim  53:52  

Yeah, that's so weird.

 

Jef - System Mastery  53:53  

So anyway, just thought that that's super relevant. Because like, I mean, we're describing visually a thing that no one on the podcast can see. Yeah, but it is. It is interesting to note that if this time period, you could put out a book like this on store shelves with just five nobodies on the cover. And nowadays, you know, they'd force a Wolverine on? Oh, absolutely. Yeah. And a spider man.

 

Amelia Antrim  54:14  

Yeah, well, sure. We'd have to go through like six committees, like story. Board people and like, you know, yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  54:23  

absolutely. So this next question probably has a lot of answers. But what what do you think is one of the biggest flaws of character creation in this system? And actually, what is one of your favorite parts?

 

Jef - System Mastery  54:38  

Well, obviously, the favorite part for both of us is going to be the random table. Yeah, because that's the only thing that you steal from this.

 

Jon - System Mastery  54:46  

I mean, the biggest flaw, obviously, whether you're going with a main book or the ultimate powers either way, is the disparity of the random role for power. This is honestly one of the worst, it's a little less likely that it'll be terrible in the main book. And given that you're going to have between two to five. But when you're looking at the ultimate powers, and it's between one and 15 Yeah, it's one of those things where if you're the person who's like, I got a power and someone else goes, I have 15 powers.

 

Ryan Boelter  55:22  

I mean, you had what two powers?

 

Amelia Antrim  55:26  

An extra one because one of them was like disintegration. The other one was literally transferring that power to other people.

 

Ryan Boelter  55:33  

Yeah. But and you didn't even start with disintegration. It was like enhanced intelligence or something silly. Oh, that's

 

Amelia Antrim  55:41  

right. Yeah. Enhanced intelligence. And I was like, I'm not gonna give enhanced intelligence to somebody else. Like, yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  55:47  

I'm smart. And I can make you smart. Yep. Yeah. All right. I'm a hero.

 

Ryan Boelter  55:54  

Because not knowing is half the battle.

 

Jef - System Mastery  55:56  

Smart. And you can make that blue box and a high school teacher belongs in a museum.

 

Unknown Speaker  56:05  

I mean, the, the disparity

 

Jon - System Mastery  56:06  

between powers is probably one of the worst things making a character that's, uh, feels bad moment that you like you probably a Ford, you are just making this game and wanted to play it. I just, I just feel like, you know, everybody gets like four passes. It's fine. Yeah, is fine.

 

Jef - System Mastery  56:27  

Yeah, that's a much easier way to play, it would be nice, eliminate some of these random rolls and just go like, Alright, everyone play the game, as if you roll the 60 on that how many powers and contacts and things do you get to streamline things between us. And also, you can choose the category you'd like to roll on one. So you can get a shot at getting a travel power.

 

Jon - System Mastery  56:46  

But I do love the, the fact that you know, coming from the early 80s, that instead of that whole, like, Oh, you, you know, roll 3d Six, and maybe you get a three and you're just the worst, most of this, because it's percentile based, the chance of you rolling, like a feeble is so low, comparatively. And most of them tend to have a decent like curve towards the kind of like middle section of the stats. It's not great. It's still 1984. But it is definitely this progressive step in trying to make it so that characters can be somewhat balanced against each other. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  57:36  

yeah, yeah. And, I mean, there are things I like and dislike about this game. To be sure, I think that I like the concept of the fighting stat being separated from strength and agility so that you don't have any one like, guaranteed God stat that exists around that range. You have different ways to contribute. And notably, you can attack with any one of the four things a physical attack can be made with endurance in this game, there are ways to do that. And similarly, there's ways to make mental attacks with all three of the RIP part of the acronym. Oh, interesting. I liked that. I liked that everything's got value to it that you can kind of lean on your best stats and play optimally. There is a lot that is hard to like. Notably, a bunch of stuff we never even engaged with all the like robot construction rules and how magic is entirely a hindrance and nothing else.

 

Ryan Boelter  58:29  

Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's it it feels very 80s for sure. And there was pretty much the random tables and the fact that you could get literally almost any superpower you can imagine with the with the ultimate powers book was was kind of fun, but then like, you know, rolling it up and and writing it all down and keeping track of it and when not for me personally not the most fun experience maybe just don't make change lanes you need the book warned me everybody warned me just take out change lanes and and we're good

 

Jon - System Mastery  59:16  

yeah, the I think the main problem with making a character in the ultimate powers book is because you have every power available Do you have a far less likely chance of getting some of the very core powers you know like we said before getting flight is so ridiculously small of a chance Yeah. Since it's just one set in travel powers that lets you do that if you're

 

Ryan Boelter  59:42  

doing it all random right like it does say you can pick your stuff if you want and and I can see coming approaching character creation in this game of this is the type of hero I want in I want to I want to hear that can fly. That's you know, you Nearly invulnerable, but then like, you know, maybe maybe, is a computer genius, as well. And maybe on they only have their powers in the virtual world, or whatever, right? And now Now how do I push him on? Or do I piece all these powers together and create that person? Right? Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:00:21  

That is kind of the fun of the random tables just to be like, Okay, I've got this massive whatever stuff. How do I coalesce this into a character? Yeah. And that's, that's fun that it can be tricky to switch that from fun to playable. Yeah. Like, I think it's really fun to kind of, to kind of pull the character out of the the collection of junk that you rolled up. It is a different question entirely of can I apply this character to the tabletop, even though I managed to come up with what he is,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:00:48  

right? Yeah, like, here it is, leave versus statistically mechanically, can happen.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:00:55  

Mechanically, when you look at it, even when you pick the powers, let's say you're like, Oh, I wanted to make kind of like a cyclops guy. And I wanted to have energy blasts. And that's my thing. And I've got a couple other, you know, small powers. But if I roll three powers, one of them as energy blast, I have to randomly determine the power that that is. And I'm like, Oh, I have, like, poor energy blast. But randomly one of the other non important powers managed to get like, it's amazing. I go, Well, I guess you're my main power.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:01:28  

Right? Yeah, I guess I'd guess I'm changing my concept again. Yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:01:33  

yeah. That is kind of weird. That whole, like, you get a power and it could just be garbage. Like a really cool power. It is garbage. But then you get a really like mediocre power. And it's a suddenly monstrous. And

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:01:47  

oh, I love that there is even in the games like BCI area, essentially, where it's just here's all the examples of heroes and villains and all their stats and powers. There are people who are like, what do you have? I have levitation at feeble and like, what does that mean?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:02:06  

And from the Avengers has, yep. Yeah. And it's like, what does that look like? Dr. Drew? And what can you do? Well, I can very slow I can go down for if I fall off a building, I followed elevator speed, I can

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:02:16  

basically lift my feet off the ground and kind of float around a little bit.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:02:22  

yesterday. Yeah, yeah. It's not looking at me

 

Ryan Boelter  1:02:25  

it's a power for flavor, more than the more than a useful power at that point. Right. Right. Yeah, that's, that's kind of interesting. If you approach it from like, a narrative sort of approach to playing the

 

Amelia Antrim  1:02:39  

game from the 80s. We don't approach anything. Narrative, like that's the problem, right?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:02:43  

So it's an interesting system to create an interesting conglomerate of characters that you can then put into a narrative game and have fun with

 

Amelia Antrim  1:02:54  

Yeah, right, which is exactly what we're gonna do. Like,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:02:57  

you can be like, Oh, here's the character and I'll put them in a system where powers work the way I want them, right?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:03:02  

As it stands, if you ever played the game channel A, no. John Anna, you have it's a card game that where you get a couple of cards handed out to you that are different parts of an anime, and you have to assemble them into the title or description of an anime and then like pitch it to the other players, like the whole game is

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:03:20  

just a pitch meeting and whoever is judging picks their favorite pitch.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:03:26  

It's really fun and and the thing I'm pointing out is that it's over when someone picks the pitch. And this is a great game for that to be like alright, let's roll up crazy characters and see what they can do with them. And they come up with with what they are and you're like, This character is part of the moon and his head's a balloon and another rhyming thing. Weird stuff. We don't want to play that we'll come up with what it is and he just kind of look around the room and go I think the one who's the Southern Gentleman God vows funniest one this time. Let's let's just write Hootenanny

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:03:57  

you when started

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:03:59  

over rather than put actually putting to put them onto the tabletop. Yeah. Or if you want to definitely use these random results, come up with crazy random things and then port them over to a game that works in a streamline. Yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:04:14  

like I'm having a difficult time figuring out like, Why does my character that I created here exist? Like like how low what what? What random nonsense.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:04:28  

What uncaring God

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:04:29  

would allow this to happen. I still think that yours is fully definable. Just say technical mishap going gray goo scenario just a

 

Ryan Boelter  1:04:36  

technical mishap and I'm not sure what that means in high school scenario, but that creates this monstrous Changeling that can have five different forms.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:04:48  

Well, you all went on the field trip to the nanotechnology factory. Yeah, I guess. And then a box of nanites exploded.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:04:57  

Field trips. They're so dangerous. field trips

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:05:00  

are the number one way that superheroes

 

Ryan Boelter  1:05:02  

requires a signature from your parents for a reason.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:05:06  

Well, yeah, but what if you're an orphan robot?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:05:09  

And you nobody cares if you die?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:05:12  

That's true. No, the book said

 

Ryan Boelter  1:05:16  

I guess if you're sentient think you're sentient if you if you get killed on purpose, right? Yes. That makes sense. Oh my god. The part of the part we've been waiting for is

 

Amelia Antrim  1:05:30  

the part we've been waiting for. It's fanfic time what do our dinner plates look

 

Unknown Speaker  1:05:36  

like the only thing we discussed here this portion is what do our

 

Amelia Antrim  1:05:40  

secret lair

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:05:41  

What is this? What are we doing

 

Amelia Antrim  1:05:43  

fanfiction section where we don't play the game although Ryan Do we get a fanfiction section for this one?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:05:49  

We Okay, we have to season our dinner plates. Like like is the AP that we're doing? Is that going to be like a season two episode or is it already established? We established already

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:06:03  

I'm not only gonna say not only are we established but we're about a 70% chance we'll just use the other day another game to do it.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:06:09  

Exactly. So like okay, so fanfiction like what? What a season one looks like have this. This this wild Halloween Sentai sort of thing like how what do our origin stories and whatnot. mean?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:06:23  

Well, okay, first of all, do we want this to be set at a Halloween themed High School?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:06:27  

Or are we at Monster

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:06:29  

High Monster High? Are we is this part of is this a spin off from those dolls those Monster High? Frankenstein's rats? Is that what this is? Or are we just playing as those I like I feel?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:06:47  

Every character except us is totally normal.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:06:51  

Yeah, normal high school and then the spider robot sitting in class doing algebra?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:06:58  

Yeah, yeah. And the whole thing takes place in the town that hates Halloween.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:07:02  

Right? Nobody questions why there's a spider robot that's just like, never discussed. Oh, yeah.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:07:09  

Yeah. No, there's there's a full grown man of Frankenstein walking around and everyone's like, yeah, that's just Roger. It's fine.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:07:18  

That's just green for Monster problems. Fine. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:07:20  

He's just like, super into metal and kind of weird. I don't think that there's anything else going on.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:07:25  

Dude, everyone loves Godfrey. That guy's always holding candy.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:07:28  

Yeah, and Roger is only into metal because someone gave him a rad haircut for the top of his head. Right like that that chunk of skin came from I don't know the recently deceased Glenn Danzig in this universe universe.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:07:39  

Okay.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:07:43  

Yeah, Glenn Danzig made Veronica and then died and donated his hair

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:07:46  

side of shame. Have you seen that?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:07:50  

It's on the list for movie mastery. No.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:07:54  

I need to have case have different forms for each class. And since since Chase has such a high intelligence, I'm going to say there's there's been at least multiple times where where they've had two classes and the same time period and they've had to hop between each class changing forms between each class. Oh, yeah. And then like you don't know case

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:08:21  

is a good student but I think they've got some sort of irritable bowel syndrome you're always going to the

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:08:25  

bathroom. Also they're always only in one class. I mean, you gotta attend the rest of the classes a different kid attends that class some other kid named chases in this other class different kid though it's

 

Amelia Antrim  1:08:36  

a really common last name amalgam

 

Ryan Boelter  1:08:44  

case spectrum

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:08:46  

but yeah, my character is definitely a person who was born right here in high school that that in some medical lab or something he just woke up and was like, oh, what sort

 

Ryan Boelter  1:08:54  

of high school is anatomy

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:09:01  

every superhero origin story can have

 

Ryan Boelter  1:09:03  

a high school okay so high school where

 

Amelia Antrim  1:09:06  

Why are you trying to make sense of this did you not sit through this character?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:09:10  

No, I'm the God of Halloween and when I came down to earth my entry okay created other people and now we were all bound together so

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:09:21  

we said that the Flash TV Show origin were one singular event caused all yeah Smallville

 

Ryan Boelter  1:09:28  

has to be right we were all in the right place at the right time to to have the because I my was apparently created because of a technical mishap and well yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:09:39  

let's say I landed in the quad at this see the various rooms that all three of you were in happened at the same time when I exploded out from there.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:09:53  

But I get to animate stitch together cadaver of various people biology fine Really just a fetal pig.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:10:01  

That was like AP anatomy and physiology class. And then like,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:10:07  

we take our AP classes way too seriously.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:10:09  

I'm a creation of the robotics team. Yeah, yeah. Yep. Just make sense.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:10:15  

And, and I would be from the from the IT club

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:10:21  

or computer lab. Yeah the computer club. Yeah. And then I would be from biology and there you go. We're just have three kids and right and or at least you know, I'm a full grown adult but I still you know, I got high school students brains.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:10:32  

This is the this is the scene you see in every single intro to the episodes every single like the credit seamlessly on like, where it just shows can Meteor shoots into the closet. You got the music plane you got the giant pumpkin meteor hitting the ground and then all three of us in a split screen like ah transforming

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:10:53  

freeze the God of Halloween. Yeah, when he's not messing around.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:10:59  

And then, of course, you don't know what Earth is like until you you know, simulate. So you think everybody's a high school student? Because that's,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:11:08  

you know, part of my power has been imbued into all three of us. So, yeah, I'm not quite God level.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:11:15  

Yeah, I assume that that was your final act of a power that you had before you felt Earth which was just random Halloween Caprice? See, we're just like, I shall come to earth and inflict Halloween, and then I shall join amongst the revelry. And that cut yourself off from some of your other powers. Yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:11:29  

well, now that I no longer have the aspect of trick, costumes or spider.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:11:36  

The most famous parts of

 

Amelia Antrim  1:11:39  

bits of Halloween. Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:11:42  

Everyone knows the

 

Amelia Antrim  1:11:45  

spiders. Ceefax. Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:11:50  

Why didn't you enroll in pumpkin? We'll just have to assume there's an NPC who's the pumpkin Ranger. And

 

Ryan Boelter  1:11:54  

that's another reason why you're traceable.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:11:55  

Which is a super bummer.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:11:58  

Yeah. So that's another reason why your treat because you gave the gift of all these powers to

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:12:03  

actually

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:12:05  

there you go. That's why you have all the character and then they all just started trying to resume Halloween or Thanksgiving life. Thanks, Thanksgiving. I've been on the phone too long. No. I'm gonna say well after Halloween High School. Yeah, that's true. But that is that's almost definitely the foes is Thanksgiving who like, you know if we could get them out of the way that Halloween could last longer?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:12:28  

Yeah, obviously her nemesis is Christmas trying to come early and like

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:12:33  

our turf keeps creeping closer.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:12:35  

Closer. Is Santa Claus or nemesis? Almost

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:12:39  

certainly. I mean, instead of being

 

Amelia Antrim  1:12:44  

because we're afraid of passers by. Oh, yeah. I'm afraid of

 

Ryan Boelter  1:12:48  

pastels. That's true. I mean, Easter Bunny is like one of those situational villains that comes in every now and then and kind of shuts it down. Yeah, the great thing about

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:12:57  

my weakness to pastels is that it's just it's just my powers off. But I still have an unearthly strength. So I can just punch a bunny in the space. Now can we? Can we say that the way it worked was that all the gods of the various holidays descended on this one high school and infected a bunch of kids? Oh, yeah. And that and so our rivals are just other kids in the class. Like, like even you can tell that I'm in a class because there's just a full on adult Frankenstein sitting in a big in one of those kid chairs. But then like behind him, there's a Santa's elf. Yeah, I don't like that Frankenstein. You and me after school buddy. Three o'clock.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:13:34  

Just a kid dressed in like blue pastel overalls, with a little like, bunny on it and his Johnny peeps, and he is here. Today?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:13:46  

Yeah, so it's all it's all the same high school

 

Ryan Boelter  1:13:49  

right? Oh, wow. Holiday high? Yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:13:54  

Wow. And depending on how popular the holiday is, it will have more like foot soldiers and so on in the school. So like, there's just one weird kid for Arbor Day.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:14:02  

I was gonna say is there one kid like is like dressed as a tree or like in like, yeah, like green?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:14:07  

One kid who's always setting off firecrackers. Yeah, of course.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:14:11  

Yeah, yeah, kids

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:14:13  

are real pain. Yeah, that's independence. Right. Independence did spray. Get dressed him?

 

Unknown Speaker  1:14:20  

Ah. Wow.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:14:26  

Be right back. I'm gonna make independence, right.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:14:30  

I liked the idea of there's a whole group of different New Years. This guy, one Jewish guy, one Chinese guy.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:14:41  

So this will be an interesting,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:14:43  

like a different one every year though. It's like

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:14:46  

animal sidekicks every year.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:14:48  

And they're led by Greg Orian.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:14:52  

No.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:14:56  

Never give us any ability to do it. The thing we will screw up now

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:15:04  

is Gregor Ryan's so good.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:15:06  

Greg Orion. Wow. That was that was something. Let's talk about advancement. If we wanted to take this further.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:15:19  

Yeah, I would love to figure out how we can take this up a level. Take it up a level,

 

Unknown Speaker  1:15:25  

level level. Take it Sure.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:15:27  

I'll just tell you right in advance that this game has the almost legendarily worst advancement system.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:15:33  

Yeah. So we've been like doing this, you're like, Well, you have your karma, but good luck.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:15:38  

The problem with Karma is it serves too many masters. It really does. Karma is your short term bene mechanic where you get you earn it for doing good things. So like, oh, you saved us a million. Here's 30 Karma. Hey, you showed up to the game today. Here's for karma. It's one of those engines, you know, where like, you're supposed to the DM is supposed to carefully pieced together how much karma to give you based on minor activities and playing and playing well is always one of the last listed reasons. But by the same token, there are significantly more and faster ways to lose it, not just through spending it but through things like Oh, you missed, you missed a coffee date, or you were late to class because you were fighting the scorpion. And so that's constantly sapping your Excel

 

Amelia Antrim  1:16:22  

frustrated that that's a no win situation, though, as a player, right? Because it's like, which thing Do I lose more for?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:16:29  

And it's encouraged. And obviously, you're gonna go fight the scorpion because you're gonna be playing to punch the scorpion. Yeah.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:16:36  

And I mean, you'll get aggregate, you'll be net positive for beating the scorpion in karma. Because you get karma for, you know, stopping villains, rescuing people, things like that.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:16:47  

You might be net positive, unless he like knocks over a clock tower or something with his mighty tail during the fight. And then you take the hit for that. Yeah. And now, then, we already talked about how you spend to earn power stunts. And that is a ludicrous amount of karma spent over and over and over again until they become official. And if you just want to buy a power, Whoa, boy, they start well over 1000 Karma.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:17:10  

Wow. Great.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:17:11  

Let me just give you the example that rescuing a person, like so that they don't die is 20 karma points. And in a single rescue action, you can only ever get up to 100. Yeah, so even if you're like I pick up a building full of people and move it so that all of them don't die, you're like, Yeah, well, you didn't save way more than five people. But you get five people's worth of

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:17:36  

plastic thing where you stop a school bus from falling off a bridge. The only thing it would matter is if it had less than five people on it, you'd be like, oh, you know, if I want to save that school bus. What is that? 40 Karma. Saving three people is way less useful than saving five.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:17:51  

So you'd have to say five school buses. One of the time people

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:17:54  

on the beach. Yeah, yeah. Wow. Yeah, it's, it's an unreasonably punishing mechanic. And then again, it kind of makes sense. Because with the occasional exception of like a special event in comic books, superheroes don't usually advance the way that other characters from role playing game genres tend to you know, fighters get more powerful. And eventually they build a castle on a track 20 min or whatever. But Spider Man is spider man. And he was Spider Man and day one. And he was Spider Man on day 300 Or four him when they gave him the ability to reincarnate from a giant spider or something. But for the most part, we know his powers and they are relatively unchanged. I

 

Ryan Boelter  1:18:34  

mean, unless you're in the MCU. And he's got exoskeleton power suit, basically, that gives him extra powers.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:18:40  

Losing powers, because he cuz at the end of the third movie, he loses that thing.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:18:46  

Yeah, the I mean, karma if it was just used for the power stunts, and that was it, like you had a baseline, whatever your powers were. And instead of having to randomly roll for how powerful they were, they're like, Oh, you get one amazing power. And you know, two excellent powers or something. And all you did was karma, instead of being XP is just there to up your roles, or occasionally do something weird outside of what the rules say for you. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:19:20  

that would be something.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:19:21  

So that would be neat. But instead it is you could roll real bad. Be like, Oh, I've got a feeble in the power I really want to use I guess I'll save up my XP to keep bumping up the levels of that. And that'll take way too long. You won't be able to use your karma for any fun things.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:19:43  

It really feels like leveling up in the system is just not overall enjoyable.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:19:48  

You're not really I mean, I know that a lot of superhero games are like, Yeah, we want you to be a superhero out the gate and so leveling up isn't really a thing. That 10 has to exist in the same way that other games have leveling up. But with the fact that this has the whole like, oh, it's not just that you got this power, it's that you got it at a random or rank that you might want to level up. It kind of ends up splitting the difference between having having leveling mechanics and not. And it feels like it's much worse for it.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:20:24  

Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah, this just seems frustrating. Yeah, yeah.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:20:31  

I mean, ultimately, the one thing you can really say about most superhero games is that they are very well designed for one shot play. Yeah. Yeah. Campaign play. It's rare to find a superhero game that has an advancement system that I would describe as satisfying. I would say there's of all the ones I've ever read maybe masks and outside of masks, even even sandals, which I love to the ends of the earth. The it's designed intentionally with a with a broadening only advancement, so all you can do is change stuff.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:21:01  

Yeah, that makes sense. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I never really thought of that, that that superheroes are, you know, I mean, even if you look at the comics, like, their powers haven't changed too much in like 80 years. It's why

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:21:14  

when you get one of the the horrible, late 90s, early 2000s things with the open game license, where someone's like, Oh, I've got a superhero game, and I decided to put it in D 20. Oh, now you have levels of hero, and you end up being real weird. So like, I'm level one. And I can't fight anybody. But I'm level five. And now my light beams are better. Yeah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:21:41  

like you look at heroes Unlimited, which has a classic d&d style leveling advancement, your character can level from one to 15 it doesn't affect anything but like your skill percentages and your hit points. Yeah, it's it's it's practically a grafted on afterthought. Yeah.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:21:53  

I mean, like, how much damage your spells? Yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:21:58  

you're a caster?

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:21:59  

Yeah. So ultimately, advancement seems like it's almost never the point. And I kind of appreciate that. Because, you know, I want to be a hero, when I'm a hero. Exactly. You want to start as a hero. You don't want to start as a nobody and eventually get like one little power. Yeah. So it's just an interesting aspect of superhero game design.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:22:16  

I have never actually thought about that before. That's a really interesting revelation.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:22:22  

That's what we bring. We're here for. Ah,

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:22:27  

so the free tacos, which are wildly late, I gotta, I don't want to be rude. But he's free talking. We're told there would be free tacos.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:22:35  

I'm sorry about that. I dropped the ball in the free tacos, you know, three more appearances and you get a free T shirt. So

 

Amelia Antrim  1:22:46  

that's true. That was the that was the run out of superheroes. Now we can find more. Oh,

 

Unknown Speaker  1:22:52  

no. Absolutely. I have

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:22:54  

at least five more on the shelf behind more. Ah,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:22:58  

so Jeff and John. Thank you so much for joining us are talking about Marvel superheroes?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:23:05  

Yeah, seriously. I mean, also not but as

 

Ryan Boelter  1:23:10  

as as exasperated as I was throughout most of this process. I had a lot of fun.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:23:15  

It was good time. And,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:23:16  

and we created some characters that good or bad? are memorable, exist.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:23:24  

Good or bad? They were bad.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:23:26  

We sure did make characters.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:23:30  

Absolutely. Can you remind everyone where they can find you online and the sorts of things you're working on

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:23:36  

system mastery. podcast.com, where we make our show system mastery, where we go through the depths of RPG history to pull up the weirdest, craziest and worst ideas in game design over the decades to talk about it to make fun of it and to have a good time. We also have some other shows where we review movies and Star Wars books. And of course we ourselves write books. We are currently promoting our fourth book, The dungeon Meister cookbook 75 recipes to get your table advanced from the level of just pizza and Mountain Dew. Pop it open to get today and try some goat cheese and herb pinwheels are gnocchi German potato salad. Oh man, I made that thing recently. It was incredibly amazing. Oh, two German potato salad. But you substitute the potato chunks would gnocchi get out of town?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:24:23  

I Yeah. Why? You'll get the book. Okay, get the book.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:24:27  

It's available on Barnes and Noble and Amazon. It's under 20 bucks full color. Very beautiful rifle.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:24:33  

Well, John, do you have other things to plug? Or did Jeff say all your things or any?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:24:38  

Well of course, if you want it to support us, you can go over to Patreon. At patreon.com/system mastery not only can you get a whole ton of bonus content, we do a ton of stuff over there. But it's also super useful if you listen to all of our shows. You can get one RSS feed that will have everything we do. So if you're loving what we do, and you want to support us and you want to get everything in one place. That's the simplest way to do it.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:25:07  

That is super true.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:25:09  

Awesome. Well, thank you both so much for doing this with us. This was, this was a good time, I think I think I had five. I mean, I enjoyed watching Ryan be exasperated this time, which was, I mean, that was phenomenal. So thank you for that.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:25:23  

We do what we can. And thank

 

Amelia Antrim  1:25:25  

you to everyone for tuning in.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:25:30  

Call to Action. Yeah, like that.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:25:34  

So Marvel Marvel superheroes were done with it. The 1984 Slash 86 version of the game. I was very excited to see that a new version is currently playtesting. Which kind of blows my mind. I was very excited to check it out. And then I saw some of the stuff that was going on there. And I was less excited. But, you know, maybe,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:26:03  

I mean, I think out of a sheer curiosity, I want to know, I think it's it's different than a lot of the modern superhero games. Yeah. Are it seems to be kind of sticking a little more to the traditional thing that we just did, which I

 

Ryan Boelter  1:26:19  

think karma is still. Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:26:22  

yeah. Maybe they fixed it.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:26:25  

I suppose. That's what I'm hoping.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:26:28  

Yeah. I mean, I have plenty of time, right? Like, you know,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:26:34  

you would think and 20 years to figure it out. Plenty to learn from the the resolution system looks like it could be nice. Like it has some tables. It's got tables, you know, your old your old DICE has those.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:26:49  

I think, honestly, they heard us talking about the old game and they were like, quick before they ruin people's opinions of Marvel roleplaying games, we got to get this out there. So they like announced it right? Well, we're in the middle of our series.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:27:04  

That's very true. It has to be the reason?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:27:07  

Well, right. And now people are gonna go out and buy that game because they're like, Well, definitely not that other one that they talked about on the show.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:27:12  

Yeah. Because that's such as free online. Like, why would we buy that?

 

Amelia Antrim  1:27:17  

Anyway, this was a game, it was a game, it was a game.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:27:19  

Not as horrible as I thought it was going to be

 

Amelia Antrim  1:27:24  

Stockholm Syndrome, did you not listen to the audio?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:27:28  

So here's the thing. Not as horrible as it was in the in the moment. And afterwards with reflection, and through the eyes of various other folks that I've grown up with this game in London.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:27:42  

qualified therapist. Yep.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:27:46  

It's not bad. I mean, it's, it's pretty bad. But it's still I can see the the potential for fun. And I'm really sad that we didn't get to do the full base building mechanics.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:27:59  

I want to know, when do I get to do interior design, the RPG one,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:28:04  

I wanted to 40 pages of superhero base.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:28:08  

Like picking out dishes? Exactly. None of that.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:28:11  

None of that. So I don't know, maybe some bonus

 

Amelia Antrim  1:28:14  

content. Yeah, we can build our base builder base.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:28:17  

Because I really want to see what that looks like. And one of these days, you know, maybe we'll have the gumption to do so.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:28:25  

We should do that for like our next bonus content in preparation for Oh, come back to Jeff and be like, Look what we made.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:28:33  

What we made. We've got the train a pattern.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:28:42  

Anyway, anyway, calls to action. A quick reminder that he has a bed and breakfast still has a few more days on Indiegogo at the time of release of this episode. If you haven't checked that game out yet, you can follow the link in the show notes. If you want to hear more about that game, feel free to check out our spotlight episode that we did with a Jay and Lily, two of the designers.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:29:07  

It was a lot of fun.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:29:10  

I love that episode so much. And this game is just fantastic.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:29:13  

Yeah. Now if it would only like come out sooner. I'm alright.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:29:19  

But also take your time and do

 

Amelia Antrim  1:29:21  

your time. Make sure it's good. Yeah, absolutely. We are taking questions for a special anniversary q&a episode. We did this after our first year but we haven't just directly taken questions from our audience since then. So we would really love to hear from you. You can ask us literally anything. Seriously some of the questions we've gotten are not about character creation at all. No in the slightest. But we will do our best to answer it so you can find our submission form at questions character creation cast.com We can't make this episode without the help of your awesome questions. So please don't be shy, even if they're silly, even if they're not silly.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:30:06  

And you know what? It can be anonymous, you don't have to submit your name with

 

Amelia Antrim  1:30:12  

your shirt. We left that as a required field either.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:30:14  

So you can literally submit a question and and send it to us. And we would have no idea who it's from unless you told us so.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:30:22  

So why wouldn't you want to be like, famous and have your name? I guess? I think all your friends are like, that's my question.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:30:29  

That's my question. Because you can still say that about the anonymous questions, but nobody can believe

 

Amelia Antrim  1:30:33  

you. Or you could tell your friends and be like, Yeah, sure. Sure. Craig. Whatever. It's always great.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:30:40  

Craig Masterson if you want to submit questions feel free. Yeah.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:30:46  

That's a callback.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:30:50  

Yes, yes, it is.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:30:51  

Speaking of callbacks, we're still in the need of reviews. We love reading all the amazing things that you have to say about our show and we look forward to having more to read soon. You can leave a review on Apple podcasts, iTunes, pod chaser, podcast addict, and Facebook and I believe that's about it, not not Stitcher. They took that functionality away. I don't know why makes no sense. I mean, pod chaser does it better anyway, in my opinion, but, you know, Pat, take as an added bonus for you get a pod chaser. Pie chaser is doing the reviews for good campaign for the month of April. So if you leave a review for a podcast on pod chaser, and I want to say also an episodes, every episode review,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:31:43  

go through and review 190 episodes or something,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:31:47  

you want to do that. That's that's a lot of change. For the world central kitchen, every review is 25 cents towards the world central kitchen, which is helping to feed families in Ukraine currently. So it's definitely a great cause. If we reply to your review, they will actually double that. So even if you have left a review somewhere else, we encourage you to share another one in particular this month, we'll still redesign the show and we'll still read all any episode reviews as well. So if you just go through and start reviewing episodes, we'll just rattle them off as we get them so we're not picky? Yeah, we're not picky. And we'd love to read it. And you know, reviews are great.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:32:35  

reviews or reviews, man. Absolutely. Okay. They also do care deeply. So thank you for joining us for this wild series. We had a good time even when we didn't. We are off next week. But we will be back in May with something very special for series 50 Huh. I'm doing jazz hands right now. Your audience you can see series 50 series 50 which I'm really excited about. It's going to be awesome. So I cannot wait for us to record it and for you to hear it. Until then, be safe drink water, get vaccinated, relax your shoulders, unclench your jaw, it'll be okay. And keep making those amazing people. We'll see you next.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:33:50  

Character Creation Cast is a production of the One Shot Podcast Network and can be found online at www dot character creation cast.com. Add to the website to get more information on our hosts this show and even our press kit. Character Creation Cast can also be found on twitter at creation cast or ON OUR DISCORD SERVER at discord dot character creation cast.com I am one of your hosts Ryan boelter and I can be found on twitter at Learn Neptune or online at Lordan neptune.com. Our other hosts Amelia Antrim can be found on twitter at ginger reckoning. Music for this episode is used with a Creative Commons lessons, or with permission from the podcast they originated from. Further information can be found within the show notes. Our main theme music is hero remixed by Steve combs and is used with a Creative Commons license. This podcast is owned by us under Creative Commons. This episode was edited by Ryan boelter. Further information for the game systems used and today's guests can be found in the show notes. If you'd like to leave us a rating or review. We have links to various review forms out there, including Apple podcasts in our show notes. Also check the show notes for links to our other projects. Thanks for joining us. I remember we find that the best part of any role playing game is character creation. So go out there and create some amazing people. We will see you next time

 

Amelia Antrim  1:35:36  

now we got to read some show blurbs. Sure blurbs show show by show of nerves. Character Creation Cast is hosted by the One Shot Podcast Network. If you enjoyed our show, visit one shot podcast.com where you'll find other great shows like Asians represent

 

Ryan Boelter  1:35:54  

Asians represent celebrates Asian creators and diversity in the gaming community. Join hosts Agatha Chang and Daniel Kwan as they discuss gaming genre and representation with their guests. And occasionally are you with each other to the sound of Agatha his beloved air horn app be

 

Amelia Antrim  1:36:16  

okay, I did that there again for a second time. For the real time. We've got it. All right. Ryan, I'm just gonna complain one more time about this mic stand. Oh, sure. Please, I can't scoot my chair all the way in because the stupid like legs on it stick out. Like I can't sit all the way.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:36:37  

I really need to swap out. We need to trade mic stand because I don't need the circular base one that I have. And I think you would benefit more from the weighted base. Yeah. Instead of those giant legs, and I've got plenty of room for the giant legs. So

 

Amelia Antrim  1:36:56  

yes, I'd like some more time. Yes. That's my superhero.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:37:07  

Someone out there has got a fetish for that. And they are so excited this

 

Ryan Boelter  1:37:13  

giant legs. Yeah. I mean, how else does a microphone stand? Giant makes

 

Amelia Antrim  1:37:23  

a great. Couple more giant legs. Okay. All right. Serious.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:37:31  

Unique New York.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:37:33  

My son's favorite when He's warming up to record anything is photosynthesis. They're real slow.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:37:43  

It's a good word. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:37:45  

Yeah. So dude, I would do that when we were to record garbage. Food.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:37:53  

I forgot honey in my green tea. And I'm regretting it, but I'm not really because I still like it. My vocal cords. Legs, that's not even gonna make it to the Eau de we, and we lost Jeff and John. Oh, no. I was wondering why they were so quiet and then just disappeared. They were so quiet.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:38:15  

And just because they were listening to us we were we were really compelling.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:38:18  

We were really compelling. They were just like, glued to the screen not even moving. And then connecting nothing. connecting, connecting, connecting, connecting. Welcome outtakes. Ken. Jeff and John are guests. They just disappeared. Because we were that one time, I guess finally.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:38:38  

cross each other and all you can hear is you been like, well, Gosh, darn it.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:38:45  

Like we're out of here. Yep. Oh, hi. It is? No we cannot hear anything right now. Which means they can't hear me because I think Jeff's got to join in order for us to hear you. Which was in the I know he meant this. This guy this guy hit me. He just like all the internet cord out of these fools are talking about their podcast now. Let's get out of here. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:39:17  

IE. Are we back? Up? No, I

 

Unknown Speaker  1:39:21  

can hear you. Hey, you should be very go.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:39:23  

Yeah, it's unfortunately only the video is on my side. So when I joined I was like, Well

 

Amelia Antrim  1:39:30  

what got you here Alex crappy stuff we were saying about you.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:39:33  

You weren't reacting as if you were hearing me though. Which is great.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:39:40  

You could hear us but we couldn't hear you. Like nodding along.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:39:44  

So I never turned off audacity during all that.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:39:49  

Yeah, we didn't either. So I have no

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:39:50  

idea where we cut out.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:39:52  

We cut out where we were just talking about our podcast.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:39:57  

Anyway, and you were

 

Ryan Boelter  1:39:58  

you were both glued To the screen until you disappeared out of this room. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:40:01  

Yeah. You were listening very intently. I saw that you

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:40:07  

had frozen. Yeah, cuz we went into a full response about about what our early days were like. So that makes sense.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:40:15  

Well, we'll see. We'll, we'll see if we can make something work. Yeah. It'll be a nice little treat for the editor.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:40:22  

Yeah, there'll be a part where I'll where I'll be like, yeah, so we were all way too serious in the early days. Oh, I think the internet went out.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:40:30  

Yeah, it's me talking and then Ryan being like, we lost them. Right there. We're just like, stop talking about yourself.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:40:37  

Decided to Tracy call it bonus content.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:40:41  

Easy bonus content, and clean for March. Oh,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:40:46  

yeah. Ryan, I finally got your message about Martin and Lauren.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:40:51  

And Martin Lawrence. Lawrence and Martin.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:40:56  

Martin. Yeah. And King transformer. And I don't remember what else was it was

 

Ryan Boelter  1:40:59  

Amelia sons. alternate universe version of Mario and Luigi. It was Martin and Lawrence. And they were they were battling against they were electricians. I think? Yeah, they were electricians and plumbers. And they were battling against King trouser. It was fantastic. Yeah.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:41:24  

Yeah. Yeah. That had nothing to do with the game that we were actually trying to record. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, it was. It's a game off. Target.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:41:36  

What else can I close? Okay, your mouth. I'm just trying to, like 15 things open because there's all these resources and so on. So I wanted I wanted to see if I can streamline it. Yeah,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:41:48  

the answer may surprise you.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:41:51  

I thought you just said that. My parents may surprise me and I mean, they might I'm wearing peach.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:41:55  

I mean, maybe yeah, King trouser.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:42:00  

Alright, I think I'm good again.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:42:03  

Oh, yeah. Yeah. waveforms in this new area.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:42:10  

Hey, hey. Nah, there's nothing for you. And nothing for you and gay guy. But you're so cute. Or such are Poppy. You're so cute. Anyway, be mad because look at Deaf. Ah, and I don't even say that about my kids. Faces anymore. Not cute faces. Babies anymore. They're their kids now on like, my kids are fine. I guess.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:42:41  

Kids are fine. They're like little people. And little people or

 

Amelia Antrim  1:42:44  

people are the worst versions of a thing. I already

 

Ryan Boelter  1:42:52  

I understand. Yet my studio is almost done.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:42:58  

Yeah, it's the progress photos look awesome. Yeah, it's

 

Ryan Boelter  1:43:01  

wild. They finished all the drywall today. And they're gonna come back tomorrow morning. And they're gonna mud mud mud. I don't know what they call that. Yeah. But and then. And then that's kind of dry. And then this weekend, we're gonna paint and then Monday. They're going to be here to do the flooring and put the door in. And then it's done. And the trim

 

Amelia Antrim  1:43:25  

thing that was like a week's? Yeah. Wow. Yeah, we

 

Ryan Boelter  1:43:29  

might even be done by Tuesday. So I can actually be in the office for the cold open for the second episode of the series. Dang. Yeah. I'm flabbergasted.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:43:43  

That's amazing.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:43:44  

I know. So if my audio quality for this cold open, and the outtakes Welcome to the outtakes everybody.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:43:52  

On the other one for the outtakes. Oh, yeah. And let's call it open outtakes I

 

Ryan Boelter  1:43:55  

guess but we're in called open notes.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:43:57  

I don't know that. Like it's I don't think it's noticeable enough that like the average listener would know like, you'll see it when you're editing you're gonna be like, oh, there's no way isn't that you know, but like, I don't think it comes out so much on. Yeah. I

 

Ryan Boelter  1:44:13  

was messing with my game so much. I have no idea how this is gonna sound in post, but whatever. It'll

 

Amelia Antrim  1:44:19  

be fine. It's just open. You know?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:44:21  

It's just the opposite is fine. It matters to me.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:44:25  

I know but everybody also knows that you're not in the studio. So it's okay.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:44:29  

That's true. Okay, thanks everybody for understanding we'll leave it there. Ah, all righty.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:44:38  

Can you not squeak the toy though while I'm doing my recording? Thank you don't squeak

 

Ryan Boelter  1:44:43  

try

 

Ryan Boelter  1:44:56  

here's why we don't buy dogs the squeaky toys

 

Amelia Antrim  1:45:00  

squeaky thank you that is a beautiful dyno baby that you brought me thank you

 

Ryan Boelter  1:45:05  

goodbye no baby can I die? No baby can

 

Amelia Antrim  1:45:08  

I have it? Oh, thank you.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:45:11  

Ah Peggy's gonna bark at me because I have it on the desk. Okay. Ah, Peggy.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:45:17  

You wanted to start?

 

Ryan Boelter  1:45:20  

You want to start? You wanted to start Wait, I'm starting okay.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:45:24  

You were all like I never get to say my game thoughts and I was like it's a back and forth we both save them and you were like first

 

Ryan Boelter  1:45:32  

I meant I meant in the last two series specifically.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:45:36  

Okay, but now I'm telling you now it's your turn to do the game thoughts you want? You want I got it because what do you wish for all right.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:45:46  

Ray Yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:45:47  

podcasting is fun we did it. Okay, this is gonna be our episode with with like the most amount of dead air removed I imagine

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:45:59  

editing silence that is gonna take forever on this

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:46:04  

more like floating

 

Ryan Boelter  1:46:05  

language

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:46:06  

Whoa, okay. This is a show

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:46:12  

this is a show

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:46:14  

we live in a society microbiome biome biome all the way that's the topic on so nevermind what's the love song and ghost

 

Ryan Boelter  1:46:25  

all I'm think whenever you okay you said that love song and Ghost in the thirst in my mind went to is I will always love you from the bodyguard. Well, that's not right.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:46:39  

It's it's that one that goes my darling. I've home good for Yoda Unchained Melody.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:46:47  

Yeah, sure. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we're not gonna be like one of the most unless edible series for character creation. I have no idea what's going on.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:47:03  

It's gonna have to put music strings between each person saying a random sentence. It's the only way you'll get it to work,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:47:09  

because we're back.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:47:14  

Are but

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:47:17  

you would think that our would be a pirate's favorite letter of the alphabet. But no, they are married to the sea, the sea. When I was in Boy Scouts, we went through that joke to almost every letter of the alphabet. Yeah, pirate's favorite letter is Oh, because he steps so my

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:47:40  

favorite letter is m because they're delicious. Because food is delicious. Brian's favorite letter is I Kevin? Yeah, boy scouts is dumb. Turns out

 

Amelia Antrim  1:47:51  

like honestly, I don't think like kids are dumb. Like, the jokes are not good.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:47:59  

Well, I might just go to the ocean today. That's one of my many powers, you know, going into the ocean. The two of us can just leave our house right now. It'd

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:48:05  

be the ocean in 10 minutes. Yeah, but I hate the ocean. And all that dwell within it.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:48:11  

Well, let me ask you this then. Do you have any spare change

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:48:16  

our our quarter? He'll be added for hours.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:48:21  

Oh, man. I'm just sitting here reading all the people really mad about Chocobo GP. What? Oh, it's a kart racing game for switch that was going to come out. That came out a couple of days ago. Fantasy racing game. Final Fantasy racing game. It's the sequel to one that was on the PlayStation One a million years ago. Oh, unfortunately, it's a $50 game that is a mobile game. Like it's got every mobile microtransactions thing that is possible. Dollar game you have

 

Ryan Boelter  1:48:51  

to $50 to play start playing the game. And then massive microtransactions incredible

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:48:57  

amounts all the way when you turn the game on me like get the pop up. That's like, you know, season one unlock cloud and Squall if you spend $8 Now and then also $15 later and if you play the Battle Pass to level 65 Wow. Wow. $50 game you should just give me cloud.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:49:16  

Yeah, that's wild.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:49:18  

The reason those things exist in other games is because they are free and then trying to milk you for money.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:49:24  

Yeah, yep. This is a double dip and a lot of people are grumpy Yep.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:49:30  

Oh wow.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:49:32  

Wow. No, I just finished reading the joke about GP thing apparently the in game microtransactions currency that they give you for like winning races and stuff expires. Oh my god to stop to try to stop you from trying to save it. They'll it basically like all you can really unlock is a coupon that lasts a while for the real money you have to spend Oh,

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:49:53  

wow, man, this is just amazingly bad.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:49:58  

Yeah. Ben that time to launch.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:50:02  

All right, and before we hit stop on our recordings, we wanted to plug Jeff's Thane and reinsert that at the beginning

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:50:13  

Stormer, though, Jeff Stormer Yes. My book. Okay.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:50:17  

Jeff Stormer Yes. Okay.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:50:18  

Yeah. All right. Hang on we get to the Slack channel about that.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:50:22  

All right now we can now we can press stop for this portion of the recording. Three and a half hours here we go. He Ah, yeah. First recorded waveforms in my new studio.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:50:39  

Oh my god. Do you see it makes you sound like a robot?

 

Unknown Speaker  1:50:43  

Oh, no. Oh, no. Back to the drawing board.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:50:47  

Tear down,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:50:48  

tear down. Oh, I'm peeking like nobody's business. It taken out of context.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:50:54  

Brian's family

 

Ryan Boelter  1:51:00  

I did it. I didn't capture genuine laughter when I was testing it, so how do I know if I wasn't peeking?

 

Unknown Speaker  1:51:20  

Oh,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:51:22  

it's okay. I like peach way up. Haha

 

Ryan Boelter  1:51:30  

All right. All right. I think we're officially at the peak bliss point. And my input level

 

Amelia Antrim  1:51:40  

its peak list does that mean it's smooth,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:51:42  

smooth, smooth, smooth, that is not the jagged, wasteful

 

Amelia Antrim  1:51:51  

the wave form wave sounded like mine. Oh, a little rough, but smooth and blew up rough and smooth. Rough was opposite.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:52:06  

By it's like it's like rough on a like macro level, but at a micro level. Nice and smooth.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:52:13  

Yeah, for sure.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:52:15  

That's science. Science. All right. Well, I've got waveforms they are blue, just like my walls. But not

 

Amelia Antrim  1:52:25  

okay was Ryan waveform blue audacity waveform blue.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:52:32  

Be the worst. So there might be a shade in there too, but no, it's the actual name of the color is Oceania, Oceania, Oceania and it's very ocean like it's a nice deep blue with a gray undertone and a little bit of green and I've got everything set up I got my nice art behind me have my OC for my in person game group and my Character Creation Cast banner on a chair because I

 

Amelia Antrim  1:53:12  

was gonna say it's not like up Yeah, I have

 

Ryan Boelter  1:53:15  

to wait for my my fancy soundproofing panels get rid of this reverb that most people won't be able to hear because

 

Amelia Antrim  1:53:24  

nobody can hear but you look even here like i i noticed it a little bit because I'm listening for it but like it's not enough that like if I were a casual listener, I'd be like oh my god that guy's got another reverb wow look at that reverb to say like I am really picky. Sit further from your microphone down your gain even when it's like watching Twitch streams to I was like dude you're pulling out your mic back up Stan peeking your way for Oh my God turned on me because I'm like sick again bro anyway podcast, yes. Okay, I will do a five count and then we will go Oh,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:54:15  

for sure. Somebody just turned off the lights.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:54:20  

See that you're like in the dark there.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:54:22  

was turning off my lights. I got Wi Fi late so like people are able to just turn things off. I

 

Amelia Antrim  1:54:29  

didn't know if there were like a like motion you were like not moving.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:54:34  

No, it's it's all it's all Wi Fi baby.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:54:40  

i When are they? Okay? Exactly. All right. I will do the recap. Real quick. I needed to water. I'm like super thirsty lately. Delicious. Water he wants to get So, waste so moist, and so upset about the word moist. I'm gonna get this out. This is recorded everyone can hear it. Everyone was so upset about the word moist. Yeah. And no one talks about the word Saki. I agree. I propose that soggy is worse than moist because soggy dry something that should not be wet and is whereas moist could be something that like, like a cake is moist. That's good. It's supposed to be like that. Soggy cake. No.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:55:33  

Like, but the only thing that can be soggy and fine is a sponge.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:55:38  

Even then, though, you're kind of like it's like it's kind of like wring it out, you know,

 

Unknown Speaker  1:55:43  

squishy? Yeah, yeah, there's

 

Amelia Antrim  1:55:45  

nothing but that's pleasing.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:55:50  

I don't know.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:55:52  

No. One time I did forget the word moist though. And I was trying to describe a cake to my ex husband. And he like makes fun of me for this still. That was like, you know, it was just like really? Like, I don't want to say juicy

 

Unknown Speaker  1:56:08  

No, wrong. Not okay,

 

Ryan Boelter  1:56:13  

QC also another really great word, but not in certain contexts. Right? Not for cake. Not for just like moist. Good.

 

Amelia Antrim  1:56:22  

Bad.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:56:26  

Cake. Really bad. Really? Honestly. Soggy cake is an accident. Juicy cake is just an abomination. It was an intentional abomination

 

Unknown Speaker  1:56:42  

so if you have questions about this

 

Amelia Antrim  1:56:45  

about cake

 

Ryan Boelter  1:56:50  

questions that Character Creation Cast back yeah, enjoy outtakes boy

 

Amelia Antrim  1:56:58  

it took everything in that image not interrupting be like, and another Changeling and then another change five boy we did it. Wait, it only took 24 minutes. There we go. He All right. Oh, waveforms. Look at those waveforms.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:57:24  

Everybody loves a good old fashioned wave form. Not me. wave form.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:57:30  

Like it says on my I hate wave form shirt. Oh, wait, this is the Avengers.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:57:35  

I mean, mine is truly accurate as it is born. Hungee

 

Ryan Boelter  1:57:40  

it would have to be a transformer shirt at that point. Right. All right. That's Soundwave not waveform.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:57:45  

Yeah, I mean, waveform should be a transformer.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:57:48  

I don't see any reason why it wouldn't be. There might be an Autobot that turns into a tape player as well. I'll probably feel like there is one thing I keep hoping is that as generations of transformers continue to come out that sound wave never changes from being a cassette player.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:58:05  

Right? It's just always eventually it's not going to make any sense.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:58:08  

Look, I turned into a boombox and I've done yeah, I picked cassette

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:58:13  

player. It's not my fault your cut your planet is evolving rapidly on tech fronts. Your tapes are coming around again.

 

Unknown Speaker  1:58:21  

Is it though?

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:58:24  

Because he's like, I'm a robot.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:58:26  

His tapes aren't even tapes turned into like little vaults or

 

Ryan Boelter  1:58:30  

vinyl appears to be like kind of eternal at this point for some reason. But how come there isn't a vinyl transformer then want to record player? Oh, cuz then it would just be skipping all the time. When he's moving. She'd be an

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:58:41  

insufferable hipster. Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  1:58:43  

I didn't buy a CD player last week because my kids went to the library to check out audiobooks and they come on CD and we're like, we don't have a CD player like nothing plays CDs anymore.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:58:54  

It's true all my computers don't have any kind of drive now. No, I

 

Amelia Antrim  1:58:58  

will have both my kids have Chromebooks for school so don't do anything.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:59:02  

Yeah. I don't have any drive either. Born Hungee ah best shirt I love this shirt makes me happy

 

Amelia Antrim  1:59:16  

All right, let's do this. All right, I'll do a five count and then we will born get going.

 

Ryan Boelter  1:59:23  

Amazing. As such I see I wore my spider man shirt because it's by one like Marvel shirt. Like the Spider Man DaVinci

 

Amelia Antrim  1:59:31  

Nice nice.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:59:32  

I'm one eight Spider Man. There you go or whatever on my mother's side. Because 123456 Yeah, there's seven there's eight Avenger types on there.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:59:41  

Yeah, except for one of them is ghost writer who is not an Avenger. I think he's been an Avenger. Everyone's been an event. That's all this is all it matters.

 

Jef - System Mastery  1:59:49  

I mean, Spider Man's fairly rarely an Avenger himself.

 

Jon - System Mastery  1:59:51  

I mean, he's part of the new Avengers. He is a core founding member of the new of

 

Ryan Boelter  1:59:56  

Nicolas Cage going to be in the MCU That's all I care about.

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:00:01  

Probably sooner than you think. But probably not in a role that it's going to be. He'll be he'll be like a villain who's the ghost writer?

 

Jon - System Mastery  2:00:07  

Oh, he'll, he'll have the ghost writer that's on a horse from his movie.

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:00:12  

There you go. The Sam Elliott Ghost Rider. Yeah,

 

Ryan Boelter  2:00:15  

I know there was already a ghost rider in the in the MCU technically through the TV series.

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:00:20  

Yeah, but that doesn't count field.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:00:23  

Shield was can in

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:00:26  

one way. It was a one way flow it could it could pretend it was part of the MCU. But the MCU was never going to pretend that Agents of SHIELD was a part of it. And the last season of Agents of SHIELD basically went nah, JK we don't exist. Yeah, they went on their own little world tangent.

 

Jon - System Mastery  2:00:39  

They did a time travel thing. So now they're like, Yeah, we wrote ourselves out

 

Ryan Boelter  2:00:44  

and finished the series. I don't think I did. But I know. I know. I got to that time travel nonsense and the end of the world sort of thing. But either way,

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:00:53  

like I think I think Agent Carter is the only one of those shows that was actually cannon. Interesting. Because the butler from it showed up in endgame. Oh, yeah.

 

Unknown Speaker  2:01:03  

That's right. There you have it.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:01:06  

All right, Marvel's I'm gonna do a five count and then we're gonna

 

Ryan Boelter  2:01:11  

technically we were on topic a little bit. Okay.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:01:22  

I was for when this game was released. I was not born yet.

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:01:28  

Well, at least I was for for the first version of this game. Yeah. Something I was too. I was a wee baby. You will be born Hongi I was born hungry.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:01:40  

All right. Yeah, we can start by recording. No.

 

Jef - System Mastery  2:01:44  

Yeah, right. I can do that. I'm just sitting here looking at this book. I haven't really flipped through yet. Oh, oh, it is awesome. It's I mean, it's the least healthy thing you could possibly make. Yeah,

 

Amelia Antrim  2:01:55  

he ate. Hey, Cookie, hey.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:02:03  

I did, I did some temporary adjustments to my studio. I have a large blanket up on one of the walls. I literally put a rolled up rug in the corner of the wall. And then draped a blanket from that to an ironing board. Nice. And and that got rid of, I'd say about half my reverb. Okay. Just with that. And then like, you know, some other stuff that's going on over here.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:02:35  

I keep thinking about like, How can I like drape something nicely in this corner here? Like how can I like, you know, like to make it not look like garbage though? Because it's you know, because I have to look at it. Although, yep. So

 

Unknown Speaker  2:02:50  

I wouldn't really

 

Ryan Boelter  2:02:52  

Oh, you could you could do like one of those 10 things where it's like a pull up in the corner. And then and then it could drape down to some other supports along either side of the wall. And then you would have this like, like,

 

Amelia Antrim  2:03:06  

a little canopy over my desk. Yeah. That's like a little office princess.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:03:11  

Exactly. Yeah, it would look pretty sweet. I think. I don't know. You'd have to be a second of blanket.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:03:16  

Well, like, I mean, there's that. And then there's also the fact that like, right here is the closet door. So like there's not really room for anything to like, go on the side of this side of the desk. FERS door right there that like the desk bumps right up again, like the door can't even close all the way because the desk is right there. Yeah, just like a hair

 

Ryan Boelter  2:03:33  

too big. Yeah. But I mean, you could also have a princess desk. So

 

Amelia Antrim  2:03:38  

I could I have like a bulletin board and stuff right here. And I've got like stuff up on the wall here to, you know, make it a little less, but it's just that corner.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:03:46  

Yeah. So just a little princess tree, as well.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:03:51  

Yeah. I mean, I was like, just like it would be better if I just like turned this way and didn't tuck into the corner, probably. But that's fine. It's not that bad. It's where the desk is. So it is true.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:04:05  

Okay, well, well, at the very least, my panels will be here before the next recording. That's exciting. And I'm very excited about that. And then I just have work to do to get them on the walls. And then and then I shall post pictures everywhere because it's been a long time coming. Yeah. Yeah. Very fun time for it. Yeah, absolutely.

 

Unknown Speaker  2:04:35  

Ah,

 

Ryan Boelter  2:04:35  

called off and I feel low on energy today. But like to I don't know where it's coming from. But like, I just feel like mellow or mellow the normal. Yeah. So like, some might be it might be a more low energy cold up. And so I mean, if that's the case,

 

Amelia Antrim  2:04:55  

we it's fairly short. It's not too bad, so

 

Ryan Boelter  2:04:59  

it's not too bad.

 

Unknown Speaker  2:05:00  

Yeah last time

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:02  

we were like we were really kind of slap slap happy though so

 

Ryan Boelter  2:05:05  

that's true. Maybe we'll have a normal

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:07  

like, rational level. I mean let's not get too crazy

 

Ryan Boelter  2:05:12  

I

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:15  

hesitate to say professional right I hesitate to call it good

 

Ryan Boelter  2:05:23  

now wait a minute Emilio we're not back good

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:25  

sorry. Carried away

 

Unknown Speaker  2:05:30  

at the moment. Uh huh That's all good

 

Ryan Boelter  2:05:34  

all right, shall we? Shall we record a cold open shall have lubricated my mouth. Oh, excellent reminder. I shall also lubricate the vocal cords with the Aqua

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:46  

yes, we could just like moisten them off good and soggy

 

Ryan Boelter  2:05:52  

my my nice nice juicy

 

Amelia Antrim  2:05:58  

juicy mouth

 

Ryan Boelter  2:06:01  

why

 

Amelia Antrim  2:06:06  

Yep, can't wait for that to be in the attics.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:06:10  

I think my game might be too I don't know.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:06:13  

About juicy mounds so juicy

 

Ryan Boelter  2:06:15  

knows Yep, I'm peeking too much because I've talked about juicy mounds welcome outtakes We apologize for nothing All right, looks like I'm starting the show. So I'll give us the content.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:06:33  

And we'll go from there. Okay, here we go. Two seconds. My dog is chewing on something and I don't know what it is or if it's the thing she's supposed to be doing.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:06:43  

Sure. Peggy's stuff Stefan I suppose the exciting that's so exciting for you.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:06:58  

That's the best puppy life get to destroy cardboard whenever you want.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:07:02  

Go I live on cardboard. Peggy wait

 

Amelia Antrim  2:07:10  

not strong enough.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:07:12  

You'd like like a wrench or something for that thing? Well, it's Yeah, I mean, it's like a little knob like just a little bit a little bit more torque.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:07:19  

Yeah. Gotta get to sit gains.

 

Unknown Speaker  2:07:23  

Gains burl Gaines.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:07:25  

Okay. James cut that.

 

Ryan Boelter  2:07:31  

That James. James. I can't even put that in the outtakes. Oh, you audience will never know what we were just talking about.

 

Amelia Antrim  2:07:40  

Nope. Nope.

 

Unknown Speaker  2:07:43  

secret secret? Got a secret. Okay we did a recording it's hard to see my

 

Amelia Antrim  2:08:01  

mouse

 

Transcribed by https://otter.ai