Character Creation Cast

Series 50.1 - Dungeons and Dragons 5E with Aram and Dylan [Kill Every Monster] (Creation)

Episode Summary

Welcome to the first episode of series 50, everyone! This series, we welcome Aram and Dylan from the Kill Every Monster Podcast, to revisit Dungeons and Dragons 5E by utilizing supplements to enhance your games. This episode we dive into commentary on D&D itself, what makes something D&D, and a lot of other great discussion before we dive into a very interesting character creation session!

Episode Notes

Welcome to the first episode of series 50, everyone! This series, we welcome Aram and Dylan from the Kill Every Monster Podcast, to revisit Dungeons and Dragons 5E by utilizing supplements to enhance your games. This episode we dive into commentary on D&D itself, what makes something D&D, and a lot of other great discussion before we dive into a very interesting character creation session!


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Guests and Projects:

Aram Vartian @AramVartian

Dylan Malenfant @DJMalenfant

Kill Every Monster @KEMPodcast

Games and Tools discussed this episode:

Dungeons and Dragons 5E:

D&D Beyond:

Monsters of the Multiverse (Orc Ancestry):

Guildmaster’s Guide to Ravnica (Loxodon Ancestry):

Tales of Arcana 5e Race Guide (Hologod and Vroom vroom Ancestries):

Planet Apocalypse (TBD):

Nightfell (Rogue Variant, Backgrounds):




Our Podcast:

Character Creation Cast:

Amelia Antrim:

Ryan Boelter:

Our Website:

Our Network:

Network Patreon:

Episode Transcription

Transcripts Automatically Generated - Not 100% Accurate

Ryan Boelter  0:01  

Welcome to Series 50. Everyone. Goodness 50 series


Amelia Antrim  0:07  

50 of these 50 of these


Ryan Boelter  0:10  

has over 50 months of work on this podcast. Yeah. Which is just mind boggling.


Amelia Antrim  0:18  

Yeah, it's like, it's good. It's good that we've done 50 of these, but also like, where, what?


Ryan Boelter  0:26  

Where did the time come from?


Amelia Antrim  0:28  

That happen? Like, yeah, I'm still in shock that it's been four years, like, yeah, I feel like, I don't like was there a time in my life when I wasn't doing this? Like also? Also, it's still very new, you know, I don't know, just,


Ryan Boelter  0:43  

it's wild how long four years feels and how short it feels at the same time.


Amelia Antrim  0:47  

Right. And mean, and I don't know how much of that is the fact that the last two years have been a lifetime? Yeah. But it's hard to say.


Ryan Boelter  0:56  

That's fair. Like somehow we've been keeping it going throughout this whole thing. And,


Amelia Antrim  1:02  

yeah, we had to cut back a little bit because because the pandemics been a lot. We're like working from home. I was I was homeschooling my kids for most of last year, I fell down some stairs. I, you know, had a lot of health issues last year. Oh, yeah. So. But the fact that we've we've managed to keep three out of four, every month still feels pretty good. Exactly. And I still hold that hope like, dear listeners, we really do want to get our evolution cast episodes backup, but just they require a lot more planning and effort than so much more. Yeah, the other episodes, and it's a whole other day of recording too. So the doubles are, I mean, not doubles. But like, it doubles our number of days we spend recording. Exactly. Yeah. But I'm still I'm still really proud of what we have, like after 50 series. It's, it's great.


Ryan Boelter  1:52  

It's great. Absolutely. I'm really excited, because this month, we've got the folks from kill every monster. My name is Dylan in Iran. And we're making some some really bespoke d&d FFIV compatible characters.


Amelia Antrim  2:12  

Yeah, I'm really excited about this, because we in series one, we covered d&d. And so we wanted to do something cool for series 50. Because 50 is like a cool, exciting number. It's a big deal. But it's been a long time since we visited d&d. And there's a lot of stuff out there. We talk about d&d all the time. So we decided to sit down and make d&d characters using almost anything accepts d&d. And it shows. We had a great time. We had a great time.


Ryan Boelter  2:47  

It was so much fun. But Wow.


Amelia Antrim  2:50  

You're in for a treat everyone. Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  2:53  

I apologize. If if the episodes for this series, at least these first two episodes are a little long. Because we recorded for five hours, somehow. Yeah, just for the first two episodes. And I'm pretty sure an hour and a half of that is unusable. Like not even for outtakes. Right. Yeah, there was no content. There was a lot of content. But we'll we'll see. Some of those outtakes might make it up somewhere. I know, Rob and Dylan. So they might take some of the stuff that we can't use on our show, and put it up by him for bonus content for themselves. So we'll see what comes of that. But yeah, we've got that we've got q&a episodes coming up later this month, after the series,


Amelia Antrim  3:50  

so we'll play coming up with all kinds of stuff.


Ryan Boelter  3:54  

So we'll will quiet down a little bit so we can get to the announcements. So we aren't here forever. So you can find out about some of these cool things going on.


Amelia Antrim  4:05  

Yeah. So first, as Ryan mentioned, we have our q&a episode coming up. We are going to release that after series 50. There are five Mondays in May. So normally, we would have two weeks off. But our hope is that we can release our q&a episode. We have a bunch of questions. So we're going to probably split it up into two episodes. And then you'll have something every single Monday in May. Wouldn't that be great?


Ryan Boelter  4:33  

That would be great. That said,


Amelia Antrim  4:35  

this is probably your last chance this round to get your questions in. We've had quite a few already. But we really want yours to we really want as many questions as we possibly can. So if you have any pressing questions for us about character creation, about ourselves about what we like him aims about game design really anything? You know what we like to dip in ranch or not? If you're right, please feel free to ask. We don't know We love answering these kinds of questions is great. So you can submit your questions at questions dot character creation and we will try our best to answer them.


Ryan Boelter  5:27  

Absolutely. Next up, we've got some bonus content coming to the One Shot network secret archive for Patreon subscribers at the $5 An uplevel. It may actually be there already were recorded this cold open the Tuesday prior to the release of this episode. So if it's there, check it out. We'll have it in our show notes. For this, we stumbled through the base creation rules for Marvel Superheroes


Amelia Antrim  5:59  

stumbled is putting it generously just start over like three times because I kept getting too frustrated.


Ryan Boelter  6:04  

We did. There were some good nuggets that I was able to pull out of that frustration and that made it into the episode but goodness gracious. It was an ordeal. We did figure out what kind of pattern we had.


Amelia Antrim  6:21  

What was clearly the most important part of that game. Exactly. So


Ryan Boelter  6:25  

I'm really happy that we were able to do that. And honestly, once we figured out a system it was it was a lot of fun. So


Amelia Antrim  6:33  

was it the right one? We don't know. Exactly.


Ryan Boelter  6:38  

I mean, for listeners that enjoy the Marvel Superheroes game and enjoy and have used correctly, the base building mechanics for Marvel Superheroes you know, you can add us after listening and let us know how off we were from


Amelia Antrim  7:00  

Yeah, so here's the thing we said it in the episode we can say it here now too. Is that like please don't ask us to tell us we're wrong. You're well aware. Oh we know that we are interested in knowing exactly how wrong we are. Exactly or we're wrong. So if you do know how the base building mechanics work in Marvel, please please tell us you know the rules I guess. Please please,


Dylan Malenfant  7:27  

please let us know because we tried so hard. We've been


Amelia Antrim  7:30  

losing sleep trying to figure it out like lay awake at night. Do you think maybe we both roll on the table? No, no,


Ryan Boelter  7:38  

that can't be right. What's happening here definitely hit us up on Twitter or you can even hit us up on Discord at discord dot character creation And we'd love to be proven how wrong we


Amelia Antrim  7:53  

were. Yeah, absolutely. Like I said, I just want to know like why we're wrong? Yeah, absolutely are we know but I just don't know why. Other ways that you can support us would be by leaving a rating or review on your pod catcher of choice because we don't have that anymore. Apple podcasts is the most impactful it's the one that people see and you know comes up when you Google things there are not a ton of places to leave podcast reviews so you can check out parties or podcast attic Facebook. But if you happen to leave them anywhere that isn't one of those places, please let us know and we will go dig it up so that we can read it. We really like reading them so please leave them and tell us where you know everyone this really like please tell us how podcasts how to game how how read


Ryan Boelter  8:53  

oh good podcast. How are you podcasts?


Amelia Antrim  8:58  

Sometimes your 50 series is in and it's just too much you know


Ryan Boelter  9:03  

it's it's fine is too much in a good way and honestly if I'm if I'm gonna lose my mind doing a project it's it's fun to lose my mind with you Amelia so


Amelia Antrim  9:14  

yeah, I mean same it's like you know one of those like, this is how I'm gonna go. That's not so bad Oh, here we go. Drumroll for the for the most important announcement everyone.


Ryan Boelter  9:29  

Oh, yes. There you go. Picks up in the mic. Finger snaps. One last announcement. Hey, my new studio is all set


Ryan Boelter  9:45  

so I got the sound panels up on the wall. I've got the ceiling panels hanging from the ceiling. And it's virtually like eliminated my my reverb.


Amelia Antrim  9:56  

It's so different. No, actually you do actually I can I can tell


Ryan Boelter  9:59  

right Even Amelia can tell


Ryan Boelter  10:09  

it's a bit No it was It was wild because I took four different snapshots of my soundscaping here right? And like from no panels to panels just laying against the walls to panels partially installed to everything fully installed, right. Yeah. And like and then I did said the most basic, like sound cleaning I could think of. And it was just a stark contrast between the all of them. And then this one was just like, wow, this sounds like I'm in a studio.


Amelia Antrim  10:41  

Yeah, it's just I can tell like there's not as much reverb for sure. It's yeah,


Ryan Boelter  10:48  

it's, it makes me happy. So I'm happy for you. Yeah. If you want to see on my twitter I learn up to you and you can see some pictures that I posted on there. If you're creation cast discord, yep, yep. Check them out. Because this thing is a thing of beauty. I've got my art on the walls. It's pretty nice. Yeah, no, I really excited and I'm looking forward to future recordings in here. And I think it'd be really nice to have this space and and get a table in here. I got plenty of room for a table couple chairs and then maybe you can visit and we can record something cool and


Amelia Antrim  11:34  

find some cool two player game then try them out.


Ryan Boelter  11:38  

I'm sure there's quite a few of them out there. There's there's a whole podcast dirt Yeah, right.


Amelia Antrim  11:46  

Okay, well, all of that. That is it for announcements, believe it or not, that's all you know. That's all Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  11:52  

that's just that, just that


Amelia Antrim  11:56  

join us after the episode for our calls to action and our reactions to this episode. For now enjoy the show.


Ryan Boelter  12:37  

Welcome to Character Creation Cast a show where we discuss and create characters the best part of role playing games with guests using their favorite system. I'm going to be heroes, it's Ryan. In this episode, my co host Amelia and I are excited to welcome Dylan and around the hosts of kill every monster, a podcast covering the monsters of d&d.


Amelia Antrim  12:59  

Welcome to Character Creation Cast. I'm really excited that you're here. I'm so excited for this.


Dylan Malenfant  13:05  

We're excited to be here. We're slowly bringing together all the aspects of playing a game of d&d we got we got monsters I know some folks who do the magic podcasts.


Amelia Antrim  13:17  

People like eventually, eventually, we will have old


Dylan Malenfant  13:20  

d&d We'll take it over.


Aram Vartian  13:24  



Amelia Antrim  13:25  

are coming for you as Dylan, can you tell us a little bit more about yourself the kind of projects you have going on and where people can find you online? One, just one piece at a time.


Dylan Malenfant  13:41  

You just reminded me of projects? Oh no, I am. I am a grad student. So all of my projects are boring and hard. But also, I do kill every monster where we as mentioned have some guests on and let them talk about their favorite monsters and how d&d sometimes just doesn't quite nail the design. Have a lot of fun with that one. You can find me on Twitter at DJ melon font,


Ryan Boelter  14:06  

and a ROM about yourself.


Aram Vartian  14:08  

And my name is Aram you could find me on Twitter at AramVartian I am the creator of Gods fall and the CO producer of kill every monster and also the editor of total party throat which is a podcast I enjoy a lot. And Dylan I have like just you know, like I forced him to do this during the pandemic and because it was the pandemic he was bored enough that he agreed. It is phenomenal.


Amelia Antrim  14:35  

One small moment of a lapse of judgment.


Dylan Malenfant  14:40  

A small moment of a full year of staring at a blank wall.


Aram Vartian  14:45  

Yeah, it was better than I was better to the abyss. That's what I like to say.


Amelia Antrim  14:50  



Dylan Malenfant  14:52  

Seemed seemed better than the


Amelia Antrim  14:58  

no Do you want to give all of our listeners a quick note about this series? Our questions are gonna sound a little bit different from our usual boring list that we asked over and over again every time about every single game, because we've covered this game back in series one. So if you want to hear about basic rules as written d&d, you can go back to series one. This one, we are going to focus on the variety of supplements and variants and all of that, that you can do. So we're going to ask questions about what the system can do and what it can't.


Ryan Boelter  15:34  

Yeah, absolutely. So let's go ahead and get into this. We're going to be start by discussing what this game all about what's in a game. Alright. So rather than asking what the what the core concept of d&d is, generally, especially with how well didn't know the game is what makes something d&d For you, specifically.


Aram Vartian  15:59  

So here's what makes something d&d for me. And it's, I don't know if it's because of how d&d works, or because d&d came first and video games came after and d&d was a template. But when I played d&d, it feels like an analog video game is like an analog fantasy, video game and no other role playing game really feels that way, probably because those video games are built off how d&d works. When you get a group of people who have only played those fantasy video games, and you sit them down for the first time, and you DM for them. And all of a sudden, they get to that first dialogue tree, and there's no tree, they can just talk and you can ask whatever they want, you can watch the light bulbs go off in a pretty unique way, because it's such a direct path from what they were doing. And to me, that's what makes d&d special.


Dylan Malenfant  16:54  

Yeah, I think that's actually a lot of people talk about the fact that d&d is treated like an entry point, which from a, you know, no other background perspective, is a bad idea. It's three books long, the books are fairly convoluted, it's not really that straightforward to learn how to run the game from the rules. But as Ron mentioned, because it's the template, it's actually easy to slot yourself into it. Because though the mechanics are a little bit more of a pain to learn, you sort of already know them from just a cultural osmosis. So the only thing you're really introducing people to is that creativity aspect.


Amelia Antrim  17:33  

Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense. Because it's there, you already have all of the touch points for like, here's, you know, here's how levels work classes and


Aram Vartian  17:42  

yeah, the DM still do the math for him. So the computer is still running. for them. It's not that much of a shift for what they're doing. It's just you just, you're just basically freeing them up. You're just saying, Okay, I'm now I'm taking off all the blockers you were facing before they even realize we're holding you back from all this story. Right.


Dylan Malenfant  18:01  

I will say one of the major defining features for d&d For me, though, is labor asymmetry. Like there are a lot of games that put different kinds of work on the players versus the DM. But d&d is a game that assumes the DM is going to do a lot more work. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It didn't like so nine times out of 10. If I'm running a game where it's going to be fantasy based, and the players are slotting into just a world and I'm going to tell a story based on their actions, and I'm going to do all the work. That's what d&d is for.


Amelia Antrim  18:32  

Yeah. d&d is definitely where that like that power balance comes from this idea that like that I hate you, just as a player just show up and a game happens at you and it's great. And I don't like that. But d&d really is set up for that it's, you know, DM does all of the work of the world building and the stats for the monsters birthplace


Dylan Malenfant  18:56  

to the DM screen. Yes. Yes. Bad idea. Stop using screen stop hiding information from your players.


Aram Vartian  19:05  

role if you don't want the answer to be random, if you don't want to if you don't want the answer, don't roll only when you want it. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  19:14  

Yeah. Yeah. And if nothing's gonna happen to make other people roll. Yeah, cuz there's nothing worse than rolling and being like, No, you find nothing. Yeah.


Aram Vartian  19:22  

So now you're in the exact same situation and nothing has changed.


Ryan Boelter  19:27  

That's a bummer. But you do know something was up because you there was a moment.


Aram Vartian  19:32  

But now you have to pretend you're not suspicious for no reason. That record


Dylan Malenfant  19:36  

video game thing is what creates that. That problem of metagaming metagaming is not a problem if everyone is on the same page.


Amelia Antrim  19:45  

Exactly. Yeah.


Dylan Malenfant  19:48  

But that metagaming where it's like hold on now you've told the players there's a problem and then followed it up by telling them and there's no way you can ever deal with it. Right? Like d&d is a game with like three button If you've already pressed them all and you know there's a problem sorry buddy press all your buttons


Amelia Antrim  20:04  

yeah that's where buyers strategy where she told me Did you know that if you're in a game and you're losing you can just turn it off that's some game or stress for you you just quit


Aram Vartian  20:19  

it is interesting that the whole idea of just playing games when they're fun and if they're not fun don't anymore what concept I'm sorry


Unknown Speaker  20:31  

so we're not going to do


Aram Vartian  20:35  

things that are fun cuz that's what games are for I'm gonna close these new concepts


Amelia Antrim  20:41  

no more what is read it for


Aram Vartian  20:47  

you yeah read it for sadness read angry go to be sad. You go to games to be fun and read it to be sad. It's a nice balance. Great.


Dylan Malenfant  20:55  

bounce back and forth so frequently. Yep.


Amelia Antrim  20:59  

We know that based d&d is just like, generic European fantasy with a bunch of other lore bits from all over the place mash together like it doesn't matter if you made your own branded setting and put your face on the cover, what would that setting be?


Aram Vartian  21:16  

My face is on the cover


Unknown Speaker  21:20  

the sleeve of the book


Aram Vartian  21:22  

just saying my name is on it right it's not like hey come to a wrong world


Amelia Antrim  21:28  

what is the wrong world tell me Belkin


Aram Vartian  21:33  

road would have to have really good universal health care so let's start there. Is a ROM world's gonna collapse very quickly. It also a ROM world oh my god rom world would need so many extra signs. Just get a travel around the world book.


Dylan Malenfant  21:52  

We're not building a world where you won't die.


Aram Vartian  21:56  

Oh no, no, no. So like a Rob Right. Like if a whole world like works like me. I lived in DC for over 20 years I used public transportation the entire time. Every time I got off a metro stop there would be like you don't like in the old iPhones were to reorient the map you had to make like that circle eight motion right I had to physically like turn around my magnetism


Amelia Antrim  22:22  

the train the train only goes one direction it's on track


Aram Vartian  22:25  

it's underground I don't know where that is. Under no, it's working we're in tunnels I could be going up who possibly could know


Amelia Antrim  22:38  

around world does not have underground transportation or


Aram Vartian  22:42  

does it just that once we get above ground we just like there's like a bunch of helpful signs saying hello rom this is where you need to go like a ROM world needs and iPhone for everyone who's walking like we need directions for walking because


Ryan Boelter  22:56  

you got some some high tech d&d stuff going on here.


Aram Vartian  23:00  

We got Glassman


Ryan Boelter  23:02  

madgetech rate if you've got you will probably have to add a healing cantrip Yes. Because Lord knows d&d needs one of those.


Aram Vartian  23:13  

It would be anything that link has. Every one of us have that little sprite following us around is keeping us from dying. Oh,


Dylan Malenfant  23:20  

that's not what that's for. And Zelda. But no. Misunderstanding.


Aram Vartian  23:26  

The Zelda game has that is that clear? I just thought that was


Ryan Boelter  23:30  

technically technically from the original Zelda series. Yeah, finding a fairy would give you full health.


Aram Vartian  23:38  

Tinkerbell right. That's what I assume. Do I am I way off?


Dylan Malenfant  23:41  

No, you're right. Except it's usually like in the game where there was a fairy follow you around all the time. He just told you about what enemies do it was giving you warnings. It was like, Hey, listen, it did not heal you ever know it was your body.


Ryan Boelter  23:56  

Just said hey, listen, and


Aram Vartian  24:00  

I could really use a friend that tells me were dangerous. I mean, that would be really helpful.


Amelia Antrim  24:05  

Yeah, then I wouldn't have fallen down the stairs and broken my hand last year. Yes. Steps are dangerous.


Ryan Boelter  24:11  

Yeah. What? What is it? What does Dylan world look like?


Aram Vartian  24:15  

Okay, so I it's all farm adjacent.


Dylan Malenfant  24:20  

I honestly do think more farms are good. And more food is good. We should talk about food more. But food's great. But if I'm building like a d&d game, I'm not adding stuff. I'm taking a scalpel to it. Like there's a bunch of stuff in d&d that has weird implications. Like, I'm not a fan of the bar just ambiently existing without any explanation. The fact that magic somehow translates into music is clearly a huge world building thing. It shouldn't be a factor in the world. So when one character randomly shows up like yeah, I studied for years. I can cast fireball I can do all these interesting things. I have the blood of a dragon in me. Oh, well, I channeled my power through through a dragon Have you through a God? And that allows me to shoot lightning? And one guy's like, yeah, I learned a couple of Beatles tracks. I can make that 30 foot sphere explode.


Amelia Antrim  25:12  

Yeah. It's amazing to me that like d&d has so many books. But like, so, so much missing here because like, you know, like, as somebody who has read a ton of L five or stuff, that one suffers from the problem of like too much lore that overlaps each other and kind of undoes other things. But in d&d Somehow, like, just like, there are things that are still just not explained.


Ryan Boelter  25:40  

It feels like it wants to be a framework, right? It wants to be a place that has these concrete, building blocks with a whole bunch of space between them, but they're like all hollow inside. Exactly. So you so you fill them up yourself, right.


Dylan Malenfant  25:54  

And the other major issue you run into is because of that asymmetry I brought up before, you're also presenting the framework to the wrong people. Like if you're building a world and you say, Hold on, like for, like I said, I don't have a problem with someone playing a bar in my game, that is fine. But like if I were to try to like hollow it down, and I'm like, Well, I don't really like the way bards work. I don't want to have that be a feature of the world. The players have already seen it, they were told that the rules of the game are bards exists, right? So now I'm the monster who's sitting there telling you no, I'm going to take toys away from you. Because the game made a world that didn't make sense. And I was told to make a narrative experience that would make sense. And I can't anymore,


Amelia Antrim  26:42  

you really have to have players that are on board with you, you know, like you have to have those kinds of conversations before you've invited people to a game and you'll have to like have players that are really willing to sort of narrow down, you know, their options and follow along with that vision and trust that vision.


Dylan Malenfant  27:00  

Like most games that don't create that dynamic that don't have that separation are going to have you do a session zero where you talk about the world. And if somebody comes to me and says I want to play a bard, well, okay, cool, then I will make sure this is a world where that makes sense. Sure. But if nobody made a Bartok character creation, my base assumption is that there aren't any.


Aram Vartian  27:20  

What would you add to your world? Dylan? No, I would tell the tunes, that's guillotines. Oh,


Dylan Malenfant  27:27  

the Bards.


Ryan Boelter  27:29  

You can still have bars just didn't nonmagical you can bards, and there wouldn't be in there wouldn't be a reason to play there as a player, because they would just be people that say they're 10 birds and despite great


Aram Vartian  27:39  

coins at them, yes,


Dylan Malenfant  27:42  

they become and then they become rogues or Rangers, and they fit into like an archetype that already is fairly natural in the world.


Aram Vartian  27:50  

Whereas like, if you're going to have something where it's like you sing and that becomes magic, then song has to somehow be magic. And that has to be a an important element in your game,


Dylan Malenfant  28:00  

where you have the thing where like, all of the subclasses for BART are labeled as colleges, which means that it's an education based thing, which means it's a type of wizard, right, so


Aram Vartian  28:09  

what are we? What are like,


Dylan Malenfant  28:11  

Why are Why are those not related? So you're a music wizard now and you made your casting classes that charisma but like Why aren't these wizard actually


Amelia Antrim  28:20  

I studied musical theater,


Ryan Boelter  28:21  

but also your brother roguish and he ended with a with a rapier So like right you know combat


Aram Vartian  28:30  

is a jack of all trades thing so like it should fit it's just a part of like that one part where like d&d doesn't ever want to do the work of ecology with its monsters with its magic with its items with its land it never like do like a dragon. How much land does it take up? How much room does it need? How many other dragons could be near nearby what does that push out? What does that you know we like Like what are all these things that they want to exist in a world cannot exist in a world? There's not room for every everything. So what's the conflict? How does that work out? Is are there portals are there other like give us some idea


Amelia Antrim  29:08  

of front of the book that is like here are five lists three from each to build your world.


Dylan Malenfant  29:14  

There is one time they do that. They do that with races. You see these are the standard fantasy races. If you want wrecked two


Amelia Antrim  29:22  

L's let's be re racist.


Dylan Malenfant  29:26  

To do half orcs, those are optional and if you want to have health those are optional if you want to do a tiefling that's an option if you want to do gnomes those are optional, which they shouldn't be. They should just be discarded. Gnomes are terrible. Just make your halfling a wizard you coward.


Unknown Speaker  29:42  

Tell us how you really feel.


Dylan Malenfant  29:44  

I don't like no. I have objections. Here's the thing. Like


Amelia Antrim  29:52  

I already knew that you didn't like no, because I come up on


Ryan Boelter  29:58  

100% on kill every month Okay.


Amelia Antrim  30:00  

because that was like somehow before we recorded like, I already know you don't like no.


Ryan Boelter  30:03  

Yeah, it was it was a big discussion point.


Aram Vartian  30:06  

It's all efficiency


Dylan Malenfant  30:07  

in your design you do it with a purpose if you want to make gnomes like there is nothing a gnome does in world building that is not a halfling that learned cantrips right? So don't put them there like make your world war complicated for no reason.


Amelia Antrim  30:23  

How will we make more books?


Ryan Boelter  30:26  

DVDs about the numbers, right? It's it's, it's, like you said, it's like the video games that we we've grown up with and love. That also don't make sense, right? Because you have to have enemies to fight.


Dylan Malenfant  30:40  

And we talked about this going in that you guys wanted to feature supplements a lot. But one of the things that I keep coming back to is I built a character for a game with a ROM once I built myself an orc and I did it by saying a ROM I'm gonna say I'm an orphan. I'm gonna play human. Yeah, because you can pick a feat. And the moment you start picking feats. Like if you told me you got a plus two a plus one and a feat I could build a character in any race in d&d, because if I say I'm short and I pick magic initiate, well guess what I just made a known. Like, if I say I'm small, and I pick magic initiate, I'm a high elf now.


Amelia Antrim  31:18  

Because the differences are so small, they're so small Hasulam don't like mechanically matter. It's just like a descriptive thing.


Aram Vartian  31:25  

Feet matters more because the feet tells you what they have done until now. Like I'm a crossbow expert. I'm really good with this. Why? Because of this, I was in


Dylan Malenfant  31:34  

Texas, my training because of reporting to my culture, and I grew up as a hunter, because of the only reason the only difference between building a human that is an air quotes, elf and building an actual elf per the rules is dark vision.


Aram Vartian  31:50  

Yep, that's it. We have green eyes. That's it. Humans have bad eyes.


Amelia Antrim  31:53  

Yeah, there's, as we just finished discussing, all of us are wearing glasses. And our headphones are


Aram Vartian  32:00  

fantastic seen in Farscape, where they're all in a room and the one humans like my eyes are fine, like read that sink. And every single person can read the label from across the room, and the camera shows the sink. And because it's us humans watching it, we're just seeing a sink, we can see the label. All of them are reading the label right off.


Dylan Malenfant  32:21  

Yeah. So yeah, that's what I would do with a d&d book is I would either start organizing it into things that become optional, so that you can build a world that feels coherent to the story you want to tell. Or I would just pick what I wanted to do and I would cut the stuff that doesn't make sense.


Amelia Antrim  32:38  

Yeah, there is a supplement that came out last year called ancestry and culture Yeah, that takes apart like racism is like these things are not necessarily inherent to races but like, you know, like who your parents were and where you grew up. You know, we talked about like, learning crossbow and like all that kind of stuff is more about how you were raised than like who you are a race and so I think there are there are certainly people we talked about supplements especially people who are like yeah, no this is down and we can fix it and make it also less racist while we're at it.


Dylan Malenfant  33:10  

I also want to quickly plug an elephant and or cat a little baby by Vijay Harrison Adam Hancock which is a fantastic book again about races and half races and you know all of those stuff because so much of it is dependent on what you learn and what the people around you valued it is not a trivial thing.


Amelia Antrim  33:31  

Well, right it's like I think about like, you know, like I'm white and like you know, Irish and like I'm sure that I'm not the only like Irish white person around but like my learned experience and cultural experience still totally different from like somebody else even next door to me


Dylan Malenfant  33:48  

also like an Irish but I grew up on a farm in Canada versus Yeah, suburbs outside of Milwaukee. Yeah.


Aram Vartian  33:57  

My best friend growing up I would go over to his house and the garage door would roll up and there'd be a deer just hanging there right that they had shot that morning. That was a it was we were literally a block apart but our allies were 100% Different were raised the same same school same income level same everything right. It's really different people. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  34:18  

exactly. You know, it's like we're just having that discussion who's like my parents are very very conservative. And you know, your parents are not like totally but like we're still in America so yeah, yeah, I don't I don't think well that's like a whole conversation for another time is racist d&d.


Dylan Malenfant  34:37  

And we are not to talk about they're not the


Amelia Antrim  34:40  

people to discuss that yeah, I


Dylan Malenfant  34:41  

will point out frequently that it is a problem


Amelia Antrim  34:44  

I mean, I do feel very qualified to say it's bad, qualified enough to do a lot more but enough to be like this. This not this.


Aram Vartian  34:53  

Anytime we get in. Anytime we get specific. We go to someone and say hello your exact you know, person From experience, please come. Because we don't know, unfortunately, people have been very kind in order to do so. I really


Amelia Antrim  35:07  

love the kinds of like the kinds of discussions that people are having on your show about, you know, like some of the problems of those monsters and the way things are coded and you know, like that kind of stuff. I think that's, it's awesome. Thank you.


Dylan Malenfant  35:19  

The amount of depth we got out of a show concept that was I'm annoyed and want to complain,


Amelia Antrim  35:25  

right? Do you focus bad want to talk about it?


Aram Vartian  35:29  

We're, we're geared for it. Right? Like, like, we're ready to have those conversations. Like we have still had moments where we are completely blindsided because we just weren't paying enough attention. The dragon turtle is a perfect example. We both went in thinking it's a dragon turtle. So it's a turtle Dragon is a fun thing, whatever. It's just a monster. Not even considering the fact that of course it has huge cultural tie ends, you know, for 1000s of years that we just built, you know, just blazingly


Dylan Malenfant  35:56  

Howser. It's Yeah, which one is the Godzilla


Aram Vartian  36:00  



Dylan Malenfant  36:01  

Nakamura is the Green Lady, a camera camera.


Aram Vartian  36:04  

Like there's all these and then of course, beyond that there's cultural times for like, 1000 years, right? And we just didn't know and, and glass was like, actually


Amelia Antrim  36:19  

even like, you know, like the hag and things like that, like, my son used the word hag. I was like, actually, that's like, super sexist. Do not use that word. And I was like, I didn't know that. And I was like, well, let's have a discussion about how we talk about women who are you know, like, not super pretty and you know, but like, like I said, it's just like, they took all kinds of cultural touchstones were like, What if we put them all in a book? That's not racist, right? If we put everything in there, we just like piled on top of each other. Like technically represented


Aram Vartian  36:48  

right all stuck in the doorway. It can't possibly be racist.


Amelia Antrim  36:53  

Like what do you mean we put something of everybody's in there? It's fine.


Dylan Malenfant  36:56  

16 year old white boy mentality of I can't be racist. I hate everyone. Like, yeah, you're right. That did help. That certainly made the situation better. Way to go. Pow. Yeah. Yep.


Ryan Boelter  37:11  

So most games, Dungeons and Dragons require the player's handbook, some polyhedral, dice, pencil friends, blah, blah, blah, pizza mountain do all that fun stuff. Um, do you have any other tools or accessories that you would recommend already, that you think are just kind of cool to check out? For me,


Aram Vartian  37:33  

and I hate to say it, because it is additional costs. And I hate to tell people to spend additional money, especially when they've already bought books. For me, a person with severe ADHD who has a lot of trouble learning from books. Having d&d Beyond has been a revolutionary tool to allow me to play this game.


Amelia Antrim  37:53  

We talked about it a ton in our first episode, like you are not the only one to say that, like, Wait, there's a solid like 10 minutes. And they were like, let me tell you about d&d beyond.


Ryan Boelter  38:04  

And you see, but and you see, and you say, Don't don't like, people, you're spending money on stuff and like, people have dice and like so much dice, and they just keep trying dates. And it's fine.


Dylan Malenfant  38:17  

I do the same things I bought.


Aram Vartian  38:20  

Exactly. And it is a different thing. Like Like, all the people are like, well just wrap it into the cost, like the amount of effort people put into making d&d Beyond work is considerable. You can't just ignore that costs.


Amelia Antrim  38:33  

Like people put in, you know, like, because there's like tons of adventures and supplements, like, you get access


Ryan Boelter  38:38  

to a lot more accessible than the physical books. In a lot of cases.


Amelia Antrim  38:43  

It's nice to just have like a trove of it all in one place to not have to like again with the ADHD like if you make me hunted down, I will give up


Aram Vartian  38:52  

when I sat down at d&d Live and the cameras around me for the first time and I have to DND a game in front of a lot of people and I was scared. And the fact that I could do it from an iPad, and everything I needed, and it worked. Like the whole adventure I could run it could roll the dice could do reference hit points. Like I could just do it. It would that was amazing. That was revolutionary to me. Yeah, I literally needed nothing else to make a whole game work.


Amelia Antrim  39:17  

The idea of having to like add and subtract on camera really just gives me like Hi.


Aram Vartian  39:24  

I turned to one of the players like five minutes before the cameras went live and they actually said Do I have any discernible talents?


Dylan Malenfant  39:39  

Pep Talk you need it? Yeah, exactly. No, and it's too late. Start working. There's nothing you could do about it. What's going on?


Amelia Antrim  39:50  

What about you, Dylan? Do you have stuff that you that


Dylan Malenfant  39:53  

you use or like I annoy around? Because


Aram Vartian  39:56  

I've always no matter what he does, I love him always. cuz I just pretend he does for the show.


Dylan Malenfant  40:02  

Because despite being a child with a driver's license younger than him literally true. I like analog d&d, beyond his massively convenient, I will not argue with that. It's great for a lot of people notecards loved just note cards and a pen, like if you can write down the name of an NPC, and a couple little things and throw it in the middle of the table, so your players have it, just like making it so that all of the resources are immediately available to all your players in a way that is instantly accessible, because like, so DND, enrolled 20 You do have to build sheets, or like figure out how to work with the interface make everything. So yeah, if if I go into a new room, and I'm like, Alright, listen, comments about to start here in a big ballroom, here's the three resources that are immediately apparent in the room, you know, there is a balcony up there, there's this chandelier that you can clearly see has the ability to drop. And there's this and I'll just throw those three cards out of there. And just like, now they're on the table, you can see the thing exists, it makes things a little bit more real. So


Amelia Antrim  41:07  

yeah, I think when I, when I'm playing games in person, and when I very, very rarely run games in person, I like to have like physical things. I know, when I've run out five, or in the past, I have people like if I have characters that are using magic, they get cards that say like what each spell does, so that it's like right in front of you. And you can look at it. Like having those kind of physical handouts are super helpful. It's much harder online. In which case, like dice rollers, and like all of that kind of stuff is really nice


Aram Vartian  41:36  

interfaces, always add a layer, there's always a little bit of difficulty, a little bit of hesitation. And when you're playing a game, every little hesitation adds up. So it is really nice to have analog thing. We're like, boom, here it is. And everyone instantly understands


Amelia Antrim  41:49  

it. Yeah. And it's nice to have I mean, that is one nice thing about d&d Beyond though is that it's a sort of agreed upon thing that everybody uses. Yeah, it's not like, oh, I use this dice roller and character sheet thing. I use this one. It's like everybody who plays d&d is like, this is the one we're all in


Aram Vartian  42:06  

the opposite side. Like when I do OBS layouts, right? I take the extra time to do nothing else, but use roll 20 dice to green screen out the background. And now those dice roll live over the OBS layout so that I see it, the players see it, the audience sees it all at the same time. We all react at the same time. In that case, it brings us together but yeah, the effort to get us there. It takes a lot.


Amelia Antrim  42:30  

It definitely yeah, it's a lot of extra work.


Ryan Boelter  42:32  

It doesn't d&d beyond how it were only like one person needs to have the full thing for a campaign


Dylan Malenfant  42:39  

assigned DM which doesn't actually have to be the DM of the campaign. So just like if one of your players already has the account, do it. We can share all of their resources with the rest of the party. Yes,


Ryan Boelter  42:49  

yeah. So So if like a group that was it was going to be playing together for decades, say and they buy into that so only one person needs to just shovel everything into that one account and now now you're pretty cool.


Aram Vartian  43:06  

As long as you're all friends as long as you don't break out like all I invested at all this DoD V OD. Yeah,


Amelia Antrim  43:12  

it falls apart. And then yeah, yeah. Cos stock options.


Ryan Boelter  43:20  

Burn this bridge. I won't have all those books anymore.


Aram Vartian  43:23  

Yeah, right. I have to stay friends with this.


Dylan Malenfant  43:26  

Just want to make a real quick recommendation. This is something grant Howard had suggested was you can make location little like little tents, just fold a notecard and a half label it with the location. But if you're doing this in prep, you can also label all those features of interest on a second tent and just leave it under there. So if you're ever doing an investigation campaign, or something where they can move to different locations and you just want to have those things immediately available, you just have them out on the table like okay, cool. So you're going to the cathedral Okay, well, here's all the things you need to know about procedural and is really smart they're already there more


Amelia Antrim  44:02  

pressing grant whatever do I know


Ryan Boelter  44:10  

it doesn't mean that


Amelia Antrim  44:14  

we love you.


Dylan Malenfant  44:15  

It was awesome advice grant made for running a game or like specifically scenario that he wrote for a book. That was easier to


Amelia Antrim  44:26  

like I've played in your games before if


Dylan Malenfant  44:30  

something breaks down, writing something ahead of time. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  44:36  

And speaking of no cards, my kids just got these four by six blank cardstock cards that are for like photo backing. Yeah. And it's just like a stack full of them like a couple 100 of these cards and like these are perfect for like notes for the drying out a little map for you know, all these little things that you can do it again Mmm, like, I gotta get some of these for myself because this is fantastic. It's like a little bit more utility than a note card because no cards are, you know, they're itty bitty at times, but the bigger ones get can, but now you got to find those and stay


Amelia Antrim  45:18  

maxar state staples


Dylan Malenfant  45:19  

are usually right next to the regular ones,


Amelia Antrim  45:23  

sometimes probably like Target.


Ryan Boelter  45:25  

To be fair, I haven't shot for no card since college. And I still I still life,


Aram Vartian  45:32  

I still have them give us you've been down that aisle of a CVS.


Ryan Boelter  45:37  

I honestly don't play in person as much as I do. So like most of my


Dylan Malenfant  45:43  

electronic, I also don't slip people frequently.


Amelia Antrim  45:46  

I also just really like no cards. This has nothing to do with the amount of people I see I haven't gone anywhere in two and a half years. But I love no cards


Aram Vartian  45:54  

in this impossible opposition where I absolutely love paper and paper stuff, right? But I am so ADHD that if it's not digital, it doesn't have any use to me because it will just get up into Doom box and be lost. Like it's like not It's not functional. So I love paper, but it doesn't. It's just bad for me.


Dylan Malenfant  46:11  

You know, it's good for instantaneous reminders that you immediately throw out.


Amelia Antrim  46:15  

Yeah. Dylan, I think this was the question that you were waiting for to? What kinds of themes do you think d&d is best at? And which ones does it just not do?


Dylan Malenfant  46:26  

Literally only progression? d&d is a system that starts you at level one, which kind of sucks and ends at level 20, which is essentially apotheosis. But otherwise you get there. Yeah, if you get there, but otherwise, it's there's a lot that we've developed around it since like we've we've built a huge culture around role playing and like the creativity aspects of it. But when you look at the design of d&d, it is meant to go from room to room, bashing the monster on the head until you're a god. That's it is exceptionally bad at horror. Stop trying to run horror games in d&d, you little gremlin monsters.


Aram Vartian  47:07  

The worst possible setup for her why?


Dylan Malenfant  47:11  

d&d is about power. It is literally just about increasing your ability to kill the opponent. And there is no exit to conflict aside from death. Yep. Like the game is occasionally like, oh, and what are your players experience if they happen to find a non combat solution to the encounter, and they never give an example to find it. But like, don't give an example for what that means or how you would use any of your abilities.


Amelia Antrim  47:42  

Like email me if you think of something,


Aram Vartian  47:44  

let me know. For ideas,


Dylan Malenfant  47:46  

we could put out a fourth book of non combat solutions, but


Aram Vartian  47:50  

that's the only way


Ryan Boelter  47:52  

you roll for persuasion. You roll for intimidate if those fail, they roll. One button left and your roll for initiative. Yeah,


Dylan Malenfant  47:58  

yep. No. And that's the thing like for horror to work, you need to feel like the entire thing is a feeling of powerlessness of being up against something that you cannot handle. But in d&d, the base assumption is that there is a way around this I can handle it, which means you're going to die which means a DM now has to good DM is going to realize their players aren't backing down and try to dial it back. But now you've dialed back the threat, which means it's no longer scary, which means your players win, which means you did not achieve core, you achieved a conflict with a monster.


Aram Vartian  48:33  

d&d is set up for you to have four fights a day, and then rest. That is how the mechanics are set up. That is not how you fight a werewolf in real life. It's just not how you do it.


Amelia Antrim  48:46  

In real life when


Dylan Malenfant  48:47  

you listen, Diana gets rabies. We got to take her down life sheets.


Aram Vartian  48:56  

We've talked about it Diana knows she knows it's and because that's how the game is set up it purposely nurse whore wearables are an excellent example that werewolf is weak, and it is weak because it is easy to become a werewolf. And if all your party is now werewolves, and they're incredibly strong, it wrecks the game. Zombies are not zombies, as we discussed Yes, not infect you and cause it to rapidly spread because then there would be no zombies or there would be zombies. And we can't have that because that's not for the book,


Amelia Antrim  49:36  

you know, that your fighter is gonna get bitten and hiding, I tell anybody. Yep. Hide in the dark corner.


Aram Vartian  49:46  

Who's gonna hide is the low level palate and who doesn't have immunity to disease yet? That seems good.


Ryan Boelter  49:52  

And can you just say now that we're talking about zombies now I'm going to put us on a little bit of a tangent. There was a Twitter thread going around. If If a zombie is animated Kenyon's ghost haunt the animated corpse. And now can you have a ghost and the zombie body yet in the same encounter?


Aram Vartian  50:11  

That's interesting.


Ryan Boelter  50:13  

So he is the goat the ghost in the soul is detached from the zombie. Yeah, the body itself the body is just a husk that can be reanimated through naturally.


Amelia Antrim  50:22  

Do you know that like the soul is off doing what? are in Butler heaven?


Ryan Boelter  50:27  

Yes. So no, no, the soul comes down as a ghost to haunt this area, the same area that it's animated corpses in and now you've got this ghost like just watching its body walk around mindlessly


Amelia Antrim  50:43  

is being animated by something else, obviously.


Ryan Boelter  50:46  

Yeah, magic, right. Yeah, there you go. So there you go. So here's I thought that was fast.


Aram Vartian  50:52  

Board for all of that. I like that point a lot. Yeah.


Dylan Malenfant  50:55  

100 verses. So here's the other thing that's real fun about ghosts specifically in d&d. They're bound. Ghosts do not come into being you make ghosts, they have to be bound somewhere. So like that could of course be you die while having some sort of mystical attachment. That just doesn't break. Right. But it isn't the thing where in a grisly murder, a normal peasant becomes a ghosts. So it is actually a situation where you have to engineer this. And it's part of why they cast necromancy is evil. Because the thing you've done now is you found a dead person. You brought their you animated their body to just be living and hungry and murderous. And then you grabbed their soul and tied it to a thing in a way that immediately corrupts the soul to make it hate everyone around it. And you've just created this terrible compound monster.


Aram Vartian  51:45  

Yeah. You've also just described you though. Yeah, no, I


Dylan Malenfant  51:47  

haven't. But I am an empty meat husk haunted by a ghost that doesn't particularly want to be here. There you go. I want to give one more reason. d&d is bad at horror. And it's quantized magic. Magic exists in spell slots in discretely described spells and you can't do Eldritch Horror with magic that is clearly defined.


Amelia Antrim  52:11  

Unless you rewrite the rules, completely rewrite the supplements do


Dylan Malenfant  52:15  

which technically still part


Ryan Boelter  52:17  

of rules as written because right? Do whatever you want. Because


Dylan Malenfant  52:23  

you don't care what the book


Aram Vartian  52:28  

really mean? It I could literally hand you a guide on tic tac toe, it started with whatever you want. And it's the same exact thing.


Amelia Antrim  52:35  

What do I know? I could


Dylan Malenfant  52:37  

play chess and tell you that this is my homebrew hack of tic tac toe. And you can't tell me I'm wrong because the DMG said this was fine.


Aram Vartian  52:45  

It might even be true.


Ryan Boelter  52:47  

It might have happened that way. Yeah.


Aram Vartian  52:52  

Maybe he invented transparent aluminum who knows?


Ryan Boelter  52:59  

But still d&d.


Aram Vartian  53:03  

It's just you into a spaceship and wheels and Vulcans, but it's still d&d.


Amelia Antrim  53:06  

Okay, well, let's discuss how I have the Stargate role playing game, which is in FFIV.


Aram Vartian  53:12  

100%. Yep. So do five A, whatever you want. What was the one where they were like, are they wanted to? It was dark souls. And that was are you okay? Yes. As soon as I heard that, I was like, yeah, yeah. Dark Souls. fivey. That makes complete perfect sense. I don't know why anyone's upset. I think this is a great analogy.


Ryan Boelter  53:30  

So aside from just adventuring, what kinds of things do you think GMs should have their characters do with dungeons and


Dylan Malenfant  53:40  

play a different game? Die. There aren't rules for anything that isn't adventuring. You Anything you do that isn't adventuring is not in the d&d book, and you're making it up as you go along.


Ryan Boelter  53:52  

But it'd be like a good shopping montage,


Aram Vartian  53:54  

which you should do.


Dylan Malenfant  53:55  

And that is good, that is fine. Do a lot of downtime, have those conversations. There aren't enough things to spend money in in fifth edition, let your players via house and have a place that they operate out of and build these things up. Like those world building things are phenomenal. And those are also a great time to realize that there are other games that have written these small highly directed experiences. And legitimately in the middle of d&d when you have a session that you have to deal with a bit of story that isn't adventuring. play a different game for a bit.


Amelia Antrim  54:27  

I love when there are like those breaks between Yeah, do you do you have interest in people bring in like other games or like rules from other games to run? Yeah, social interactions or things like that. I'm a big fan of players going to parties to like meet different people and have different like, and then kind of from there, pick what adventure they want to go on based on who they meet and what they talk about it stuff like that.


Dylan Malenfant  54:49  

I'm gonna timestamp this recording real quick. Last week was the last episode of campaign I believe, where James D'Amato was running concurrently. A session in Genesis and then doing flashbacks to a game of Starcross by Alex Roberts, which is phenomenal. And if you haven't bought starcrossed yet you're wrong. Fix it


Amelia Antrim  55:12  

up. Series Three. Yep. It was great.


Dylan Malenfant  55:16  

But that's that's the thing. It's like sometimes there bits of the story where just do a different thing. Yeah, serve your need is


Ryan Boelter  55:23  

phenomenal. Yeah, the way that they they just easily blended that is so good. It's fantastic.


Dylan Malenfant  55:32  

Who's editing that show right now? Is it Tracy, or Casey is both right now. The general setup of James Tracy and Casey, that whole thing was magnificent. Seriously, good work. Phenomenal.


Ryan Boelter  55:44  

Phenomenal. Yep.


Aram Vartian  55:46  

But the other thing about it is it ties back to what we were talking earlier. If d&d is now the video game analogy, every fantasy video game has the little side quest games that are different games than the core game. So it's the perfect analog example of that as well. Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  56:02  

like if you go fishing in any Zelda game, it's like a completely different game than any game like actually doing combat or anything like that.


Aram Vartian  56:10  

Break is welcome. You're like, oh, this is nice. I want I don't want to grind. I just want to fish for the next two hours. It's beautiful. It's fun on its own. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  56:19  

Yep. In between every round in Mario Party. Gotta go do a little mini. Obviously, everyone knows that well known campaign of Mario Party.


Aram Vartian  56:30  

I can't agree with Dylan more that having a histogram I read my brain for them. I had what what was that first part you said about


Dylan Malenfant  56:38  

doing like me basically doing Kingdom building building out like the house of the players because they don't have a way to spend their money once they bought full plate.


Aram Vartian  56:46  

As soon as you can possibly give your players a base, whether it's whether it's a house, whether it's whatever it is, you give them a base, and that is going to generate story. They are going to decorate it, they're there, they're going to care about it. They're going to care about the people who live around it or who operate it, instantly invest them to Century like nothing else.


Dylan Malenfant  57:07  

We're gonna sidetrack into DM advice here. One of the worst pieces of advice that people give that is also good advice is take things away from your players. You cannot like if you give your players a magic sword, and then you have someone steal it. Yeah, that's a great motivator. But you've made the players really, really angry. It's something that was on their character sheet, it feels sacred to them. But if they have a house, if they have a butler, and you break in, or you attack them, or they own a castle, they lay siege to it, you knock over a tower. There's no inquest attached, that I have to repair this or someone came into our home and our privacy was violated. But it feels less sacrosanct to the player. Because if it was a piece on the board, it's not part of them. It was an object they own making possessions external, right?


Amelia Antrim  57:51  

It doesn't change their abilities in the game. Right.


Aram Vartian  57:55  

But it's still a violation that needs to be answered.


Dylan Malenfant  57:58  

Yeah. So you've created something that works really, really well for story hosts.


Amelia Antrim  58:03  

Yeah, yeah. Something you're emotionally attached to. Especially in something like d&d where it doesn't naturally build those bonds. Like it does. You know, there are other games where you ask all of those like relationship questions in the beginning or you know, like they're sort of like grounded in the setting or with NPCs backstory,


Aram Vartian  58:23  

they can kill all the parents they want they can kill their mortgage.


Ryan Boelter  58:29  

Easily true. Capitalism worst enemy.


Amelia Antrim  58:34  

Yes, all my characters are orphans, actually, and all their friends.


Dylan Malenfant  58:37  

Volunteer adventures are actually your adventures are actually kind of terrible. You are the worst capitalists. You have so much money, you can't figure out how to spend it. You could bring lifted entire talent out of poverty, and you decided that you were going to get a sword that shoots fire and occasionally turns into a plate.


Amelia Antrim  58:56  

Why don't you build a rocket ship instead of solving?


Aram Vartian  58:59  

I don't want to cure cancer. Dylan, I want a sword that fires lightning bolts and speaks to me it is condescending. Exactly. I want to create his own sword don't Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  59:09  

yeah, absolutely. I know. That's, that's the reason why I love like games like beyond the wall. play that with my local group. And you start off the game you make your village you'd like part of character creation is you get this thing. Now define an NPC, you get this thing. Now define a place that may or may not relate to that thing. And now you've got a village to start off with as your home base. You go to the campaign setting, you're building all the major locations and minor locations of everything around your village. And now you've got this world that every single player at that table is super invested in how much


Dylan Malenfant  59:48  

does your play your party stay in one place? Right like if you don't give them a home base. Amelia is completely right. There are other games that do a better in terms of building inter party intraparty bonds. But you're inherently going to have a bond with all the other players because they are the only constant in your experience. Put them somewhere, give them a house, they now have to come back and they're NPCs that they will bond with their people that they will see repeatedly instead of going to the newest dungeon, where the Noles should just be all all murdered until you get to the chest at the bottom. That isn't a mimic, I promise. And then you go back to


Amelia Antrim  1:00:27  

games have we played where like, the players get really, you know, like, DM makes up this NPC and then the players get weirdly attached to them always. I like right. So give them a house in a town and then that NPC can live there instead of having to go on every single adventure. They're gonna do it anyway.


Dylan Malenfant  1:00:46  

What? Kyle? The 12 year old NPC got his house burned down by a dragon Kyle, you live with us now. I sent Kyle to the PC.


Amelia Antrim  1:00:56  

Yeah, Kyle can dog sit while we adventure?


Aram Vartian  1:00:59  

And he's like, I think the reason why a lot of DMS get hung up on this is because d&d is inherently a game that was built in its bones, about killing something getting gold, gold is experience gold equals advancement. So anytime we're like, there's gold involved, even if it's like theoretical gold, like a, like a base of operations, there is a theoretic there's a theoretical amount of gold involved that even if like you found that it was willed to you by the nice old man that you saved, right? Whatever it is, there's still gold attached. And they get hung up on this idea of the gold because, again, so much of d&d is defensive, well, they could sell that house and make 50,000 gold and then buy plus two armor and now you've unbalanced the game. So much of d&d is around that mindset, which I think is fairly dumb. And that really doesn't really exist.


Amelia Antrim  1:01:49  

question though, like, because it's very clear that d&d started that way. And obviously has evolved by the time we've gotten to fifth edition. And then especially when you start adding in all of these other things people are making that are trying to do all of these different things. Like how, how do we reconcile that? Like, how do you reconcile the fact that like, you know, gold is still kind of consumed, but like, we don't really use it, like, you never really buy say, like, how do you make all of that work?


Dylan Malenfant  1:02:17  

It's all in wizards hands,


Amelia Antrim  1:02:19  

because they put Okay, well, then nevermind,


Dylan Malenfant  1:02:22  

we're a little screwed, because this whole surge of books being written, right, like this happened with the old open license around Do you remember OG L? Right? Yeah, yep. The OG l had so many, like books for 3.5. But at the end of the day, the way the core rule books get written, is they are refinements and adjustments to how the core mechanics of d&d work. They haven't been adding new things. They've been adding new classes. But every book is skills and how to do murderers and how to do combat and then someone else will release a new book


Aram Vartian  1:02:57  

vol seven make here worse, like you're talking about, like, maybe they could fix the problem, but they have decidedly made it worse by releasing things like the College of creation, Bart, who can make any nonmagical material. So now we're talking about boards that can pump out diamonds and emeralds and other things to make all the limitations on the spills that existed before. Not a problem at all anymore. So yeah, there's no limitations on actual materials. None of it makes any sense. But because it's so tied into things like you still need the diamonds to resurrect it. You still like it doesn't matter at all. It's completely ephemeral, but it still matters. They still haven't written it out of the rules. They've just weakened it further and further. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:03:42  

Seems though, like they, they want to embrace sort of this culture that's happening around d&d where people are making fun. I mean, like, they want to embrace the, like critical roles and the like, all of that kind of stuff that like, as not so much like a company but like, you know, on this cultural level of d&d, they're like, yeah, it's great that you can do anything like they're more than happy to be like, yeah, everything is d&d.


Dylan Malenfant  1:04:09  

Oh, yeah. You can do anything you want in d&d, build Star Wars d&d filled Arkham Horror d&d, right. But


Amelia Antrim  1:04:16  

they're not doing anything with the rules to really like, assist with that.


Aram Vartian  1:04:21  

Here's the problem. So the book says you can do anything you want. And when the when it's a book that works great. People read the book, they make whatever decisions they want. But that's not what d&d is as a company anymore. They just bought d&d Beyond for a reason they've been pushing towards digital for a reason this whole. Everyone being at home just kicked that forward. They're going to be a digital production company that makes things for an online experience that also has books. So the fact that they have to now force these things to work digitally, to work through computers and screens, they're just going to get more tied down into gold pieces and number ers and digits because they have to because the mediums they're


Amelia Antrim  1:05:03  

working with, right because you can't narrative Yeah, like harder to hand wave, one of


Dylan Malenfant  1:05:08  

the handful of like, fourth edition did a lot of things, right, it had a lot of good things, it had a lot of problems. One of the problems was it was built specifically for adventure leak, which is almost a diluted version of this, I need to make sure that my players wander into their game store on whatever night it was that their character is going to work even if this is a new game store. So everything had gone


Amelia Antrim  1:05:31  

cynically for characters between this level and this level. And by the end of the adventure, they get this reward and level up this much. And they


Dylan Malenfant  1:05:39  

can buy these items and bla bla bla bla bla, and fifth edition because people got mad about that is a complete reversal, where now instead of everything having a monetary value, nothing has a monetary value, you should be able to finish the game with your starting equipment, we're not going to balance monsters around you having magic items. And that's our solution. Now, the only thing d&d has ever done has made sure that money doesn't matter. Right. So either by making it part of the actual experience of like, this is now a resource that your character is really meant to spend and isn't meant to build out the World War or vice straight up just going like we'll keep giving you money, but it doesn't mean anything.


Amelia Antrim  1:06:17  

Yeah, like so making it the reward forever. But not valuable,


Aram Vartian  1:06:22  

right but valuable, which frankly, is the only which is a good thing in the end because the other way this could have gotten is that DND just said it's very very valuable and here's how you could spend real money to get it so at least he dodged that bullet


Ryan Boelter  1:06:35  

right. So my question is when are we getting the supplement or interior decorating?


Amelia Antrim  1:06:44  

So Marvel Superheroes has like what do we what do we find out six pages or something?


Ryan Boelter  1:06:49  



Dylan Malenfant  1:06:52  

wonderous items are the best part of d&d has no mechanical benefits.


Amelia Antrim  1:06:56  

I love those books when I get them when they show up and like my any stuff that was one that was like the like a Grimoire. Or like the gem hammer Grimoire I think last year that had like, it's just like a whole book of magical items. Yeah, just for funsies. Yeah,


Dylan Malenfant  1:07:09  

just beautiful. I love the house for your players. Great. Here's how much it cost to put in a suit of armor. That's also your butler.


Aram Vartian  1:07:16  

Right? Like, there was one where it was a coin. And if you drop it for every, like 10 feet, it falls when it hits the ground that makes a ding It's this little thing. So like how deep is this? Well, Well y'all can get your coin back. But you'll know how deep the wellness right little teeny things like,


Amelia Antrim  1:07:33  

oh cool, I love stuff like that


Dylan Malenfant  1:07:35  

there was someone on the discord for kill every monster who was talking about like, Hey, I have this shield that I made. Like for my game, it's a plus two shield. I'm gonna give it stuff where it can like grow vines and reach out and do stuff. And he's like, So what other abilities can I give it and make it a table that grows four limbs. And occasionally, it'll just set itself up as like a desk, and it'll walk behind you. And now it's now it's your shield. And also it's a pet. And now it's the best vitamin.


Amelia Antrim  1:08:02  

Yep, yep,


Dylan Malenfant  1:08:03  

if you can make it a pass, the moment, the moment your shield decides it's going to help by trying to pull the cart but your shield isn't strong enough to pull the cart. So it's just like straining or going like Sonic. Adorable. That's the bit that people will remember. And they for items like you could build an entire interior decorating thing. That is just five items to that effect. And they'd be magical 100%


Amelia Antrim  1:08:27  

Yeah, yeah. That's the thing is like, I would love that. And then I would love one about like throwing parties.


Aram Vartian  1:08:32  

Yes. Yeah, throwing throwing parties in d&d is great luck having a ball you do a whole episode about,


Amelia Antrim  1:08:38  

like, I would love a whole section on like you can do. This is why in strata, there's a fashion section because I told grant, I wanted it. But you know, it's like, I want to know, I want to know what the fashions are that everybody's wearing. I want to know what kind of foods they're eating. I want to know what the decor is. I want to know what weird cultural thing is happening right now. Everybody has to like act on


Dylan Malenfant  1:09:00  

one sheet per character. That is how the abilities you unlock. Like you can give me a level one to 20 and I don't have to know that going in. It doesn't have to be in the player's handbook but it started the session like you're gonna go to a party. Here's the things that a fighter knows. And this is what you can do at a party you've unlocked up to your level go


Amelia Antrim  1:09:20  

Yeah, yeah, your party skills like you know this dance move now. Like you know, the latest gossip about


Dylan Malenfant  1:09:27  

so happy to burn it entire session doing a repeat character creation of like, based on what you've done in game shows for the Burgh skills you've unlocked, you have this much power point by build your character for the party.


Amelia Antrim  1:09:44  

Yeah. Oh, yeah. And you have like this much social capital and


Dylan Malenfant  1:09:49  

it's already sort of in the backgrounds, right? The whole thing of like, oh, you're an Acolyte. So if you wander into the church, then everybody's gonna be like, You're a fighter, you're a soldier. So you should be able to go over to the bar for Find the other guy who holds a rank and be like, Oh, we're just right. And now you have a friend and by the end of the party there are seven of you over there drunk out of your minds having the background stories about the good old days yeah and that's a fantastic way to like gain information or suddenly create an in because now you know these other people


Amelia Antrim  1:10:19  

are yeah pick up a new job or something like that because you heard overheard something like more


Aram Vartian  1:10:24  

people in d&d bothered to play their backstories that would happen more often. Very few people play their back stories.


Amelia Antrim  1:10:32  

Because it doesn't it like this is the thing about d&d, though, is that it doesn't reward that right. Like, this is a it's what I I mean, to when I talk about the culture of it is that like, you know, we have things where it's like, oh, I play d&d, and we have this great character story about all this kind of stuff. And it's like, cool. All of that happened in spite of the rules, not because of


Dylan Malenfant  1:10:52  

stuff I talked about for the backgrounds, they're all abilities to circumvent problems, not interact with problems you got into town, and you don't have a place to say, well, this guy's an Acolyte. So we just go to the church, and then you don't have a further conversation.


Aram Vartian  1:11:07  

Right? It's just a lever. Yep. Yep,


Ryan Boelter  1:11:10  

there are a lot of levers. Indeed, a lot of buttons have, we've just as


Amelia Antrim  1:11:14  

we put, it does put a lot of work on the DM and on the player. So the game does not do very much work for you


Aram Vartian  1:11:22  

know, and it does set up a bad power dynamic that is frequently abused. And that's what we're a lot of the problems in d&d stemmed from.


Amelia Antrim  1:11:28  

Right, right. A lot, a lot of problems in the hobby in general. Because it is the hobby stuck around it, a lot of other games.


Ryan Boelter  1:11:37  

Throw some collaborative world building in there, and that'll fix a good amount of that power dynamic. And then lately, yeah, you gotta you gotta involve the players, or in everything that's going on, because you know, that meta knowledge is gonna be kind of gold for for going forward without having all these things devolve into it's a game a numbers


Dylan Malenfant  1:12:04  

game. Yeah, exactly. Like I can't read Second Edition Pathfinder, because there's too many tables and too many options. And I feel like I have to go, it's just a convoluted book, and I can't handle it. But I do still very much love the idea of like, having your core class and then having your point buy abilities where it's just like, Yeah, you didn't level up yet. But also, here's the 1000 feats, and they're all minor. And they're all things like, I can go to a party and make friends with the other soldiers, I can walk into a restaurant, and they'll recognize me as a critic, and then we will get better useful storytelling.


Aram Vartian  1:12:37  

Sure, but like, you read through those, like I read through a 3.5 book recently, the Sunless Citadel because I was I was prepping for a podcast at it. And like, at the very beginning of the book, in the intro, they talked about you walking through this field towards the town and this little winding road. And the description literally says, and then you walk past one day six plus three abandoned shacks, they expect you to roll for the one day three abandoned shack. So you could randomize the amount of useless abandoned shacks that no one will go into. Especially your players can feel like they're fully immersed as your fantasy.


Dylan Malenfant  1:13:17  

Sorry, I'm sorry, because the reason to have checks is to have the players go into into them. And if they're randomized, the contents of the shacks aren't set, which means implicitly, in d&d, there is nothing in those checks, which means it is extra garbage.


Aram Vartian  1:13:30  

They told you to roll one dice, six plus three, Hollywood front of shot.


Amelia Antrim  1:13:37  

Player definitely going in there, because as


Aram Vartian  1:13:40  

soon as you have to roll them, it draws your attention in a way that shouldn't, right. There's so much of that at all.


Amelia Antrim  1:13:45  

That goes back to that whole like, don't roll if nothing happens, exactly.


Dylan Malenfant  1:13:50  

Even if you roll it ahead of time, it guarantees that the DM is going to describe them. And one of the worst habits in d&d is if the DM says it, it's important,


Aram Vartian  1:13:58  

right? If you say and you walk past four, empty shaxi Immediately the adventure is now derailed,


Amelia Antrim  1:14:06  

right? Because now in my head, I'm like,


Aram Vartian  1:14:08  

why are there four? I want to speak with some animals.


Dylan Malenfant  1:14:15  

About this shack. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:14:19  

Yeah, yeah. But again, that's it's one of those like, the the rules are not the rules in the books or not the games we're playing. We're just not and it's very, extremely frustrating to me when people are like, Oh, I love d&d. I'm like, but do you do you?


Aram Vartian  1:14:35  

Do you really? Or do you love your version?


Amelia Antrim  1:14:38  

I like I get that you love the game that you're playing? Yeah, that's great. I'm super happy for you. But I don't think you love d&d.


Aram Vartian  1:14:45  

Yeah, I love Calvin Ball too, but it took a long time for us to get her from baseball. You know, we made up all these rules guy.


Amelia Antrim  1:14:52  

Right. So on on that note, about like making up your own rules and all that kind of stuff. What is the most uniquely interesting thing that you have seen? In the game of d&d, whether it was a choice a player made something that you did something you made up something you read? What is like the thing that stood out to you that you were like, Yes, this is good.


Aram Vartian  1:15:13  

So this will be one of the snuck one in particular thing. But there's a general rule about this that makes that'll make every d&d game better, right. Every time I play a game of d&d, I want one person who knows the rules more than I do, and is a little bit more of a DM than I am. I want them here. And on the opposite end, I want someone who's never played before. I want the new d&d player every time because they will do one thing that no one else will do. And it's asked questions everyone expects a no to they will ask things that everyone else has been geared to assume there's going to be a no or or at least the assumption of an expected No, and therefore won't try. But that player will try every single time. Going back to d&d LIVE, I had a player at like first level decide to try and cast suggestion on an 18th level character, because they didn't expect the No, no one else would have tried it. And they didn't expect the no and that character wrote one. So they got it. Like sometimes it'll work and no one else would have gotten you there. Unless it was a brand new player.


Amelia Antrim  1:16:22  

And, and I like those situations when they do things that nobody else would think to do because they're like, this is d&d, and this is what we do in d&d. Exactly like it when I when I run games for my kids, because they just like, they don't have those, like limits on their imaginations and like what you can do so it was just like, I'm gonna do this and you're like, Okay, I always go back to like, the first time I ran No, thank you evil for them. It was like this party scene or whatever. And my son's like, can I tell you what's in the buffet? I'm like, Yeah, go for it. And he's like, there's blue jello. And like, he's listing all of these things. And I'm like, awesome. Like, that is now important to your story that they're blue jello, like, but you just don't, you know, as as adults and people who have gamed forever. We're like, yes. When I go into d&d, I'm like, going to look around for this thing. And I'm going to, like you just don't. They're questions you don't even bother to ask because it's not important. phage


Aram Vartian  1:17:15  

I searched the buffet table for traps. I was like, No, I just walk up to the buffet table. Who is this weirdo? So


Amelia Antrim  1:17:22  

I lift up the tablecloth because I want to see like what's underneath the table. You know? Are you being a party? It's like people who just like, okay, I can do anything. I do anything. Where's the rest of us are like, Oh, I can do anything. I guess I'll hit it with a sword. Like,


Aram Vartian  1:17:38  

I can do anything. Here's my checklist of things I always do. Right,


Amelia Antrim  1:17:42  

right. Yeah. I love playing with new people. It's so much


Dylan Malenfant  1:17:46  

fun. Absolutely. This is this is a two parter. First thing, player death sucks. Unless it's gonna be really like the player character death. Obviously, player death is tragic. Well, depends how annoying to get and what you got.


Aram Vartian  1:18:04  

He's threatened several is still around. So we record online thing.


Amelia Antrim  1:18:11  

Like Canada America thing is like really


Aram Vartian  1:18:13  

long time that border was shut down. Otherwise, it would be


Dylan Malenfant  1:18:18  

only his side of the border has guns, which is really the best way to line this one up. But so a PC dying at any point, sucks. But one of the rules I set out with my parties when I run home games is if we enter a situation where we're fighting a goblin Horde, and you go down and a die roll is bad. And you would die. Unless you think that is like a cool moment and you want to do a new character. Obviously, you can opt in our baseline is you don't die. But I own you now. Now we get to wait until there is a cool moment when it would be somatic. And that's the thing that opens the door to things like the villain stabbing you in the back and you act it actually matters. Yeah, yeah. 20th level party walks in. And it turns out, the king has been stringing him along the whole time. And he puts a sword through the back of the wizard, the weakest member of the party, and you roll a d eight and add three and you're like, and you take 11 points of damage and the wizard turns around and goes iCast disintegrate. Nope, that moment doesn't work. But now you have this thing where you can immediately be like Nirn Oh, and for this. This is when it pays off. And the player gets it because it was foreshadowed because they knew from that moment like borrowed time, thanks coming. Yeah.


Aram Vartian  1:19:36  

Also players love to conspire, right?


Dylan Malenfant  1:19:39  

That's the second. That's the second half. Because that is the most effective thing to do at the start of a fight. So the other thing you always have to make sure you do is give them a lieutenant. Yeah, um, bring that player on side because he no one at the table is going to be crueler to your players than your players. 100% So when Then the wizard finally reveals his master plan and in the process of it just smites the Paladin. The Golem he just animated. Here your Paladin Destroy them


Aram Vartian  1:20:14  

100% So fun. Yeah, whatever you get to put players in different bodies, they can't wait to tell.


Amelia Antrim  1:20:23  

No, I think player death like it needs to be needs to be warranting fall because there's nothing worse than just like, okay, you know, like, I you know, I took damage I took damage, I took damage, I took damage and like because of my roles I just, you know, kind of fell apart and feels awful. And so giving players the choice to say like, is this moment narratively meaningful? Is this the moment where you want to go down and like sacrifice yourself for your grit? You know, like, give them one more round to do that. Then if they want.


Ryan Boelter  1:20:53  

It filled my perception roll and miss the trap that sprung a fireball that killed them.


Aram Vartian  1:20:58  

Yeah, that's the worst. That's the worst way to go. Yeah. Yeah, it really is. And then because there's that threat, it just creates this live this way of play where like, Chris to go into a room and check every door and listen to we get our list of roles, don't we? And it just like it adds all this time onto like a


Amelia Antrim  1:21:17  

new player. Now he's gonna do anything, right. Like they're gonna be so afraid to do anything because they don't want that to happen.


Aram Vartian  1:21:22  

Going into the world, we're going into the Trap Hole. Okay, well, let's all roll for the for the trial. And then that's how you play the thing. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:21:29  

And that's how I found I started playing bowlers get three recently and I am playing that way. Like, I walk one person forward, and they get a perception roll and dice rolls above their head, and it says, failed your perception roll. I immediately pull them back to full and the next character right could do the exact same role with guidance. So that way I have a better chance of succeeding at


Aram Vartian  1:21:55  

this. Like no, there's a checkpoint Yeah,


Ryan Boelter  1:21:58  

and I do that with all four characters if if I don't succeed, then I reload the game. Yeah, cuz I'm that


Amelia Antrim  1:22:05  

annoying of turning it off.


Aram Vartian  1:22:08  

He did. He turned it off in the turn right.


Ryan Boelter  1:22:11  

And then they succeeded my role. And then now I've got 16 ton boulders gate three, it's fine.


Aram Vartian  1:22:19  

reloaded. So I've, I've I've raised re loaded XCOM to so many times I've heard possibly, because what also goes on day in by characters after like, literally after my two those like delivered, Dylan can die. But I need to come back. I can't lose it. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:22:35  

Yeah. 100% save every turn. Every action. Yeah. And and if it succeeds, keep going. Save it. And if it fails,


Dylan Malenfant  1:22:46  

great Lophelia shaking your head. But I want to call out when you're talking about a d&d video game. It's a pre written plot that you have no say in if I fail an action in a narrative thing that we're all doing together and we're making up a story as a result of that sometimes that's the most interesting thing that happens when I know that I'm coming into a boss fight and a little bit and the game will progress until I win the boss fight and I walked through a trap and because the random number generator said so I lost a third of my health. No garbage try again. Dude.


Amelia Antrim  1:23:15  

Yep, yeah, yeah, I suppose that is the difference is like am I making like active decisions or are things happening to me? Look at


Aram Vartian  1:23:22  

it this way. Don't look at it as resetting. Look it is you're, you're caught in a groundhog day time loop. This is just


Amelia Antrim  1:23:32  

more because like, how is this foot like why are you putting this doesn't even sound fun to me. Like I just doesn't even sound


Ryan Boelter  1:23:38  

like the cinematics and the romance.


Aram Vartian  1:23:41  

Also, lots of games are about micromanagement. There are tons of fun. So this is just another version.


Amelia Antrim  1:23:48  

I guess Yeah. I don't know.


Ryan Boelter  1:23:51  

It's literally that eighth type of fun that we talked about entertaining fun episodes that that's not in the actual tabletop role playing. Yeah. So yeah, submission


Amelia Antrim  1:24:01  

type. Yep, yep. Yeah, yeah, no, thank you.


Aram Vartian  1:24:05  

Grind me into the dirt fun.


Amelia Antrim  1:24:09  

I don't like I just don't like grinding I just don't I can't do


Aram Vartian  1:24:12  

it like elevated ring stuff. Like I can't do stuff where I just kept him DESTINY I


Amelia Antrim  1:24:16  

stopped playing because it was like if you don't play all the time, like then you're under leveled and I just don't want to spend all of my time doing the same thing over and over to get up to the level that I need to be like, No, yeah, once I'm a grown woman with so much time in my day, there was


Aram Vartian  1:24:31  

a time when I needed by Warcraft, a friends once I had other friends and was doing other things Warcraft is kind of a big huge drag on your time.


Amelia Antrim  1:24:39  

Right? Yeah, I mean, that's that's the thing is like for some people that is their kind of like they have a great time with that. Awesome, not for me,


Aram Vartian  1:24:46  

right? It's it's, I can


Ryan Boelter  1:24:48  

so normally, this is where we talked about the history of the game. We already did that, like four years ago. So I've


Amelia Antrim  1:24:56  

been changed,


Ryan Boelter  1:24:58  

changed, but you Isn't it still yesterday? Yeah, yeah, we're seeing a lot more supplements kind of nowadays than then I remember at least growing up, but I mean, there was a lot of, you know, 3.5 supplements that, you know, you go to a game store and there's like, probably 100 Different official, d&d books that you could just grab, like, oh, I want everything about a monk. So I'm just gonna grab the monk subclass book or something, you know, ridiculous like that. But here's the over this


Aram Vartian  1:25:32  

left coast of the Sword Coast as a whole.


Ryan Boelter  1:25:36  

But now we're getting supplements, like, you can play Stargate in 5g, you can do all this other stuff in the 5g framework and stuff. And you you can should, should you There we go. That's that's an argument. I 100%. Agree. So yeah, it's it's interesting that we're kind of seeing this. Almost. I hate to use the word renaissance of like, games being created using this framework. But there's a lot of things. Yeah, that you can you can add on in and we're going to demonstrate that a little bit. Coming up soon. Because I found that don't perfect, worse. Race for my character. Perfect. Add. Okay, but we'll get there. All I'd say is, you know, the history of d&d, it's evolving.


Aram Vartian  1:26:37  

Yes, there is a lot of content being made around one system that makes it a universal thing. So it can all interact. And that is a singular thing that hasn't happened before that like that's the highest concentration of that. Apple could say the same thing. It's a wall. So yes, it is a very pretty walled garden that has been made right now. And when is it a very nice walled, you know, a garden to make certain games in and therefore having a large pool of people that can then buy your game. It's very easy to say, it's the Sci Fi version of d&d. It's the Western version of d&d compatible, it's all compatible. It's all non


Dylan Malenfant  1:27:18  

stop putting it into but


Amelia Antrim  1:27:21  

it is compatible. uses the same kind of dice


Aram Vartian  1:27:25  

does, yeah, come on Dylan. So it does


Amelia Antrim  1:27:29  

a little five E on


Dylan Malenfant  1:27:30  

the cover. It's competitive on there. Just be over here being grumpy


Aram Vartian  1:27:33  

that you can say that but Dylan's right. It's all like you have to do so many things to get there. You have to make so many concessions build so many bridges, when you could just say, just play d&d for d&d, pick up this other thing. And that's actually probably a better gaming ecosystem, and also makes you a better gamer, because it makes you think in ways differently, it makes you compute the math differently. It makes you get to the same solutions in different ways. So you're a better storyteller.


Amelia Antrim  1:28:04  

I have to say that I think that that Apple analogy is is good though, as someone who just switched back to an iPhone from Android, and I've been to I've been texting my friends who have had iPhones all along, because I used to have one and then I'm like, Hey, I can't figure out how to do this. And they'll go, Okay, well, if you go in here and do this, and you switch, you know, like, use the shortcuts thing. And then if you get pixelated, like, you can change and I was like, I can't just like reskin it like you have to do it each individual thing. And then I was like, How do I get the icon icons to not be all up at the top of the screen? Well, if you get this app, then you can get like a blank box or whatever that'll push him to and I was like, but on Android, it just had a grid and I just slotted them in wherever I wanted. No, you can't do that. I want to do this. Well, you can get an app. And you can go over here and to do this to make it compatible. And I was like, But why can't I just get it? It's like, well, if you want to do that, just get an Android. Yeah, like, just get the thing that's meant to do that, you know, but everybody else has the iPhone. And so now I can do the little reactions when my sister texts me and I, you know, like I, we're speaking the same language. Now, when I do that. So that way, it's more convenient.


Dylan Malenfant  1:29:10  

It's like, it's the bit that always becomes frustrating is I have a great deal of respect for all the people doing this design work. Because it is good design work. But also, it feels you're working in a bad framework. You're you're trying to build something from the ground up and a system that does not want it to fit in something that is meant for like, take the example.


Amelia Antrim  1:29:32  

There's already a thing over here that's doing it better, right, but that's trying to frustrate me, it's like we're taking away from the thing that already does it better.


Aram Vartian  1:29:39  

That's a problem just gonna get more locked into this because again, they're building for databases. Now.


Dylan Malenfant  1:29:46  

When you show up, you're like, Oh, look at this glut of material d&d must really be able to do everything. So you have these players who are inundated with the idea of like, no, no. Star Wars is a d&d game. You know, horror is a d&d game like But Just please, please


Aram Vartian  1:30:04  

is a d&d game. That's what they're trying to sell. Yeah,


Dylan Malenfant  1:30:07  

please continue designing cool games and trying to slot them into whatever framework you want. There is nothing wrong with doing that. But also please, for love of God support the designers that are building the experience you're trying to have without their square peg


Ryan Boelter  1:30:24  

round hole. Right? There is something to say though, about system is like, like if d&d is the thing that you know, you you know, the rules like the back of your hand, and you want to play sci fi, but you don't want to learn another set of rules. You don't want to go to a different system, because it might feel weird, or your GM is not used to running d&d. Now you've got option two. And that's kind of cool. I understand


Amelia Antrim  1:30:49  

there's a level of like, privilege involved in like finding a new system, because you do have to buy new books, and you do you know, whereas like, not that you don't have to in d&d, but like they're their supplements instead of sometimes. And like there's a cognitive load involved in learning a new system, though, like, as somebody who like spends a ton of time reading new games, like, it takes a toll. It's hard to do. And then you ask a group of like six people to do that.


Dylan Malenfant  1:31:17  

Or you have to recreate that d&d experience of like, okay, this is a relatively complicated system, but I'm the only one who's gonna learn it. And then I'm going to teach it to you over the course of three sessions. And yeah,


Amelia Antrim  1:31:29  

right. Every person to buy into that, and


Aram Vartian  1:31:33  

yeah, and even if you aren't planning on using it, as a writer, as a gamer is as simple as making these games if you're using dng as the core analogy, because because that's what everyone understands. Even if you even if you're going to write something else, it probably behoove you to think, How can I make this work in d&d? Okay, how can I take some lessons? Yeah, and then how can I take some of those lessons and then make this game using what I've learned trying to make this work and day in day? It's a good exercise, if nothing else?


Amelia Antrim  1:32:05  

Yeah, I will say as somebody who has like role playing games, like somewhere in their dating profile, the number of times I've had to explain to people like No, not d&d, no, you can't No, there's a better game to do that. Like no. And they're like, let me explain. But in my d&i your hinge audio, is that right? Yeah, it's like me just being like, it's not deep. I did have to take that out. Because it was too many characters like I had in there was like, RPGs, not d&d. I did have to take that out. And I regret it.


Ryan Boelter  1:32:33  

You just used an exclamation point before the d&d, and now you're writing pregnant.


Amelia Antrim  1:32:39  

But yeah, like the number of times you like, let but let me tell you about my d&d game and me being like, that sounds like this game. Yeah. It would do that better. And then they don't want to go on dates with me.


Ryan Boelter  1:32:51  

Their perception of reality? Yeah, I know.


Aram Vartian  1:32:56  

It's a real good test. Because if one of them gets through that they're good to go. Right,


Amelia Antrim  1:33:03  

right. Can we just do a quick run through of like, the basic terms and concepts we might need to know because we're going to talk about races and classes and subclasses? Things like that. So if you can give us a quick rundown,


Dylan Malenfant  1:33:17  

okay. Which are, um, you want to take this? Or am I taking this? Is it a good point themself?


Amelia Antrim  1:33:25  

Don't you like run a game, like, regularly?


Aram Vartian  1:33:31  

better at it, you know, Dylan's not gotten better, just people like me


Dylan Malenfant  1:33:38  

baffling. So, base level races is a bad term to use. It's your species. Are you going to be an elf? a halfling? What sort of background did your character come from? Coincidentally, there's also the background, it gives you extra proficiencies. No one ever uses them for anything. They're effectively meaningless the way the game is currently designed. You have your class, which is what you do. So really, they're the two things that matter your species, which is who you are your class, which is what you do. And when you start describing the character themselves, you have your base six stats, Your Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, and charisma, just the different facets of your abilities. They give you the number that you add to the die when you want to figure out if you did something, right, you get a list of skill proficiencies and if you were proficient in a skill, it means that you add more numbers to it. There's a bunch of skills, most of them don't get used. After that, you get your class abilities, which are the things that your class says you can do. You get your feats, which are better and more interesting every single time. And then there's hit points and armor class and hit points is how hard it is to kill you or how long it takes to kill you armor class how hard it is to kill you if you have harm. All right. If you have a high armor class, it's hard to hit you. If you have a lot of hit points. I have to hit you a lot to make you go down. That's the Indiana nutshell.


Aram Vartian  1:35:09  

Did you do saving throws?


Dylan Malenfant  1:35:10  

saving throws are like skills but for not getting murdered.


Amelia Antrim  1:35:13  

Oh, not getting murdered is an important skill. Not one skill is perfect. Yeah, yeah. I got. That's like the one rule I now.


Dylan Malenfant  1:35:24  

Don't die. If you die, your character will be dead.


Amelia Antrim  1:35:29  

Yep. Oh, it's


Aram Vartian  1:35:30  

don't matter anymore.


Ryan Boelter  1:35:33  

And you might end up as a ghost that's haunting your zombie body.


Aram Vartian  1:35:36  

I would like I want to write that. Yeah. I want to write so like they're like to like detach to a pendant that design? Yes,


Amelia Antrim  1:35:45  

absolutely. That's good.


Ryan Boelter  1:35:47  

We've got the history. We've got basic terms and concepts. Are we ready to make some people do it?


Amelia Antrim  1:35:52  

I think so. Let's make some people make some people people. Let's make some people. Excellent.


Ryan Boelter  1:36:00  

All right, so we're doing this one a little differently. we've hinted at it quite a few times throughout the episode. So far, we're all pulling in character options from different sources. Dillon might be making the most normal, quote unquote, d&d character here, but we'll see.


Dylan Malenfant  1:36:22  

I'm going on a steep gradient, where I have some small picks from some of the weird books. And I'm going straight back into the player's handbook, because that's where the best things live.


Ryan Boelter  1:36:34  

Amazing. Okay, so so we've got a whole bunch of supplements between us that we're just kind of pulling together and we're gonna see kind of what character options we throw out there. And then we're gonna kind of see what sort of world these this this party would exist


Amelia Antrim  1:36:52  

in. Yeah, I'm really excited for that part of like, how do we how do we make this work? And


Ryan Boelter  1:36:57  

this is gonna be a lot of fun because I was put on to this, this tales of our qognify V race Guide, which has like over 400 Different races that you can choose from. I'll save my picks.


Dylan Malenfant  1:37:15  

Specifically, not for me. Like there are so many people that would love that book. I'm not knocking at the slightest, but that is so very much not my deal.


Amelia Antrim  1:37:25  

Yeah, it's definitely definitely like changes the tone depending on what you're doing. You know, again, we started


Dylan Malenfant  1:37:30  

this like to streamline this to fit a more specific thing. 400 distinct cultures.


Ryan Boelter  1:37:39  

Yeah, so I went to a random page, Angel, elf, elf Angel. And then, and then I went to another one. And there is a race called flatulent. Yeah. And


Amelia Antrim  1:37:51  

ROM is gonna pick


Ryan Boelter  1:37:54  

yet another one. Krampus. You can. Like you Sasquatch. Yeah.


Aram Vartian  1:38:06  

Like a dog. Yes. That's like Santa. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:38:09  

So I'm going to be picking my my race from this book. Because it's, it's phenomenal. I could not pass up the opportunity. But there's a lot of amazing options. You could play a skeleton, you can play. You could play a slasher, like, character, like, like Jason Vorhees type. Cool. Like, this is wild. Yeah,


Dylan Malenfant  1:38:31  

you could build that. So


Ryan Boelter  1:38:31  

yeah. This is all in like one book. Yeah, this is white book that has just like tons of options. I'm really into it. Just say invariant. Accessibility is like, not the greatest in the book. But like, seriously, it's, it's, it's good. And I'm gonna roll with it. And we'll see what happens. Nice. So, what's what's what's everybody thinking?


Amelia Antrim  1:38:54  

I'm trying to because like a bunch of these books have like one part like this one has subclasses so it's like, I need to build everything up to the sub class that I want to do. So I'm gonna have to pick different things from different books and try to mash them together.


Ryan Boelter  1:39:09  

Well, that's that's what I need to pick a class. Oh, like to some of the books have,


Amelia Antrim  1:39:13  

you know, everything all the way through? But I don't know. I'm gonna see Dylan, what are you doing? You seem to have like the clearest plan. He's gonna make a human fighter.


Aram Vartian  1:39:28  

With both of his parents still living. Yep. Come on. They're really nice to him raised on a farm the farms doing great.


Amelia Antrim  1:39:37  

That's like the least d&d character. Honestly, that's a character


Dylan Malenfant  1:39:40  

that I'd be very, very happy to play. I played one orphan character once. And the story was specifically dealing with the fact that he was upset that his parents were dead. And we were kind of coming to terms with it. It was very fun. I enjoyed it a lot. Actually, it sounds like yeah, it was great. It's actually we'll talk later is See, there's a whole thing. It sounds nice.


Amelia Antrim  1:40:02  

It sounds very nice.


Dylan Malenfant  1:40:04  

I'm giving myself some wiggle room to lean into the party as necessary. So I'm pulling from an around the skinny scarf at this. I'm going to pull from Dragon stew and I'm going to take the baker background because that's funny, Scott. Much guided persuasion and athletics are awesome proficiencies to get out of that, and the rest of it is just like you said, it's cute, and it's a skill that I feel like can come up a lot during the game. Like that's actually a really good thing to pull from.


Amelia Antrim  1:40:33  

I like that one. Yeah, that's really cute.


Dylan Malenfant  1:40:37  

I'm gonna look through this more later.


Aram Vartian  1:40:39  

But Dylan just thinks that way.


Dylan Malenfant  1:40:41  

I know you hate it when I talk about food. Yes. Yeah, we're gonna do a baker. We're gonna do an orc cleric. Now how I how I tilt that is gonna I'm gonna pull the orc out of monsters of the multiverse, because that is a better step block than the initial orc stat block that gave them like negatives, I think either charisma or intelligence or both. We're gonna go from


Ryan Boelter  1:41:03  

there. Amazing. Oh,


Aram Vartian  1:41:07  

okay. I am playing locks it on. named Johnny sacks. And Johnny sax is a bard who plays their trumpet. Saxophone.


Amelia Antrim  1:41:16  

Love it.


Ryan Boelter  1:41:19  

How do you already have a name?


Aram Vartian  1:41:21  

Johnny sax? How


Dylan Malenfant  1:41:22  

did he come up with Johnny sax? to place his trunk? Like he doesn't


Aram Vartian  1:41:32  

show any sex has a big white, like, like big shouldered double breasted white coat. And a fedora list


Dylan Malenfant  1:41:42  

is the worst thing you've ever said.


Aram Vartian  1:41:43  

Mingo cider.


Amelia Antrim  1:41:46  

Mangoes are my favorite animal.


Aram Vartian  1:41:48  

You know what I'm here for you, Johnny sacks.


Dylan Malenfant  1:41:50  

This is work for you in the flump app.


Ryan Boelter  1:41:52  

Amazing. Amazing. How did you do that?


Amelia Antrim  1:41:56  

I want to make something like super spooky.


Aram Vartian  1:42:00  

I'm already upset saxophone is not an option in the musical instrument drop down. Alright, so


Dylan Malenfant  1:42:07  

if you got gnomes you can get saxophones make it


Amelia Antrim  1:42:10  

up. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, I can find a supplement that's got a saxophone


Aram Vartian  1:42:15  

like instruments out of


Dylan Malenfant  1:42:18  

a clarinet and there's fun because


Aram Vartian  1:42:21  

what does a song horn it sounds like a horn. Any any brass instrument is technically a song horn.


Dylan Malenfant  1:42:30  

Yeah, saxophones or woodwinds right


Aram Vartian  1:42:37  

there's also just horn I guess like it's not a horn can that went it's not called a sax a horn you're fine fine. Okay, there's also bird pipe and bird pipe could be anything


Dylan Malenfant  1:42:56  

got a whistle. That's my barn.


Ryan Boelter  1:42:58  

Yeah. All right. So I've only got my my race picked up so far. Like I said, it's from tales of our kind of the 5g race guide. And I am going to be playing what is known as a room room. This is literally a sentient car. This one Ford for this. So essentially and automobiles from the realm of motor home. Of course. They though they have inorganic exteriors internally, they are organic with a skeletal structure organs and blood like fluids. Born from a mother factory, room rooms lived harsh lives haunted haunted by vile train creatures known as tutus few have been able to make the journey to our kinda okay so now is there really tissues in this book to


Amelia Antrim  1:44:00  

look oh look because


Aram Vartian  1:44:02  

yeah, it is there a limit to how big your car can be.


Ryan Boelter  1:44:08  

Size of rooms rooms have the same dimensions as a real world car standing around five feet tall between 14 and 15 feet long and around six feet wide. They weigh around 3500 pounds your size is large.


Aram Vartian  1:44:22  

Could you be a tour bus?


Ryan Boelter  1:44:24  

Ah that might be a little too big a


Dylan Malenfant  1:44:27  

VW bus


Amelia Antrim  1:44:29  

to choose or not.


Ryan Boelter  1:44:31  

Your base walking speed is 40 feet


Aram Vartian  1:44:33  

could you be like like a VW bus though like the kind of Could you be the kind of van that like a small band might.


Amelia Antrim  1:44:41  



Ryan Boelter  1:44:42  

there's a lot of there's a lot of options on here because like carburetor cases rarity unknown even though automobiles exist in industrial areas. Your room for him would be one of the first to leave the realm and arriving here kinda. So they have a passenger compartment you can hear I have terrible climber Of course.


Aram Vartian  1:45:03  

Sure. Right? That would be a problem, sir. Right?


Ryan Boelter  1:45:08  

unique appearance.


Aram Vartian  1:45:11  

There's several. Okay, so


Ryan Boelter  1:45:13  

the appearance of each room room varies depending on what vehicle they are based on, you're encouraged to base your character on an existing brand. Or you can pick a more historical model, if that better fits that campaign setting.


Dylan Malenfant  1:45:26  

Neither of those will fit a campaign setting.


Ryan Boelter  1:45:31  

So you might resemble a truck, SUV or van, which would change the appearance of your character but has no game function.


Aram Vartian  1:45:39  

No, it's just like with transformers, they just need a state where students the ship crashes, they scan the area and get come whatever's around.


Ryan Boelter  1:45:48  

There is the variant of the room room as well, you could play a very improved room, which is an actual Senshi enticed car, instead of so it's an awakened Taurus. It's an awake Yes. Yes. Yeah. So So I gotta get figured out what type do you make? And I am going to make it a rogue. But I'm gonna I'm gonna make it a road because I want it to be a spy car.


Dylan Malenfant  1:46:24  

Okay, okay. Yeah. Yeah, it's like a scab like gadgets and it's like a disguise.


Amelia Antrim  1:46:33  

And Martin is what it needs to be.


Aram Vartian  1:46:36  

Well, that's true. But is it a fancy spy? Or is it like an FBI van spy? Like what kind of soul is


Ryan Boelter  1:46:43  

it's? It's like James Bond. Yes. By level car. Yeah.


Amelia Antrim  1:46:46  

It's an Aston Martin.


Ryan Boelter  1:46:48  

Yeah, it's like an Aston Martin. Dash. Yeah, so my long range bow attack is literally an arrow that shoots out the front or something. Right? Perfect. Yeah. Perfect. So it'd be more like a crossbow at that point. Right?


Amelia Antrim  1:47:02  

You do realize there's an entire class and race in this book called magical girl right?


Dylan Malenfant  1:47:06  

What's no hazing? No, nothing over. A class not a race. No, I agree. You're wrong about what's the same book is wrong. Okay, yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:47:20  

Why is midway


Amelia Antrim  1:47:21  

through the class?


Ryan Boelter  1:47:23  

Is there? Yes, there probably is.


Amelia Antrim  1:47:27  

I know. I'm gonna play a sorcerer that does something with blood over here. There's a thing called pain Breyer, that seems legit.


Ryan Boelter  1:47:34  

Magical Girls are this is for the age ventricle girls arise from adults. They can live as long as humans but rarely survive past 30 That's dark.


Dylan Malenfant  1:47:45  

By the end of stories like they always start off fluffy pink rainbows, but by the end of self of a life. They are dark.


Unknown Speaker  1:47:54  

Okay, so


Aram Vartian  1:47:56  

it's a little weird putting a 30 year old expiration date on a magical girls that doesn't just sit right with


Ryan Boelter  1:48:04  

all those magical girl shows you had never seen that hold her magical


Dylan Malenfant  1:48:08  

never gonna get those six series and transformation sequences that are like I'm not gonna join the fight but I know I love a


Ryan Boelter  1:48:15  

generation. I would love a generational Magical Girl story that like grandma joins in. Yeah, lady. Okay.


Dylan Malenfant  1:48:25  

Bad or an amazing grandma who like, like, can't do this anymore. Can't come with you to fight the grand necromancer but someone shows up and threatens the house and grandma just like Nope. Transformation time.


Aram Vartian  1:48:39  

Yep, here comes Gaya


Dylan Malenfant  1:48:41  



Ryan Boelter  1:48:45  

Okay, so I love I love that it could be a magical girl. But I care to be approved for a


Aram Vartian  1:48:50  

car. You can't have a car being a car.


Amelia Antrim  1:48:56  

I just, I just felt obligated to let you know.


Ryan Boelter  1:49:00  

I appreciate that. Like I said, there's four there's over 450 options in this book. And like it is so easy to just skip over like 450 of them and just holding on a couple of me like


Amelia Antrim  1:49:13  

a sock puppet. Why? Yeah, you can be a bowl of ramen. But then they do have cool stuff like like different varieties of you know, like skeletons but they also have like oni and Ori chars and I'm


Dylan Malenfant  1:49:32  

just like, wildly disappointed that the road archetype in Tosh is crucible of everything else. It's called improviser but it's about being a MacGyver and being able to create traps and I was really helping. Oh, yeah, that my Rogue went through Second City.


Amelia Antrim  1:49:48  

I feel like that's more of a bard thing.


Dylan Malenfant  1:49:52  

I think you're right.


Amelia Antrim  1:49:54  

I think like an improv Bard would be


Dylan Malenfant  1:49:55  

pretty sure that bars do and it is obnoxious Apart from just the baseline


Amelia Antrim  1:50:03  

there's a transformer in this book.


Aram Vartian  1:50:05  

Oh, there's gotta be my elephants name is Kenny G


Amelia Antrim  1:50:10  

I thought it was yummy snacks.


Aram Vartian  1:50:11  

It was the always should be Johnny sacks. Johnny sacks was a has to be


Ryan Boelter  1:50:17  

the sack that'd be God sec.


Aram Vartian  1:50:19  

Yeah, Johnny sacks is better. Sex X. No SEC HX a sap se c h. S. Yeah. Johnny sacks. I love Johnny.


Ryan Boelter  1:50:30  

Ra can be sorrow


Amelia Antrim  1:50:34  

doesn't do I want to be a part spider person or do I want to be like a digital? A digital God? I mean, some pretty good. Looks pretty Yeah. Call to Action. Yeah, like that. Ah, this episode. Hmm.


Ryan Boelter  1:50:56  

But there's there's a lot of great discussion, honestly, at the beginning of this series. Which, which is great, because that's this episode. You


Amelia Antrim  1:51:06  

know, I really enjoyed getting to sit down and talk to people who spend a lot of time both running this game and thinking about it. And talking to a variety of different people about it, too. That's one cool thing about their show is that they, they get to talk to people with all kinds of expertise about stuff. And so the the sort of unique perspectives that they have on this game, as opposed to me just being like, nice IV. Like, okay, but here's why. It's really interesting. There's a lot of fun.


Ryan Boelter  1:51:40  

Yeah, it was a lot of fun. And as you probably have heard our characters are there's something and, and it, it only gets more something from here.


Amelia Antrim  1:51:59  

Yeah. Yeah.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:03  

So yeah, you definitely have to stay tuned for next episode next week, because Oh, Lord,


Amelia Antrim  1:52:09  

it Yeah, it goes places. But it was fun. Yeah, it was always fun. We were clearly having a great time. And honestly, as somebody who listens to podcasts, a lot of times, that's just fun to listen to is just like people having a good time. Just pure casts. Yeah. Yeah. It was like, sometimes you don't want to because you're like, Okay, where's the story? But we don't have a story, friends.


Ryan Boelter  1:52:33  

So the story is the characters we made along the way.


Amelia Antrim  1:52:37  

Yep. Hopefully, hopefully you enjoy it as much as we did, because we had a great time. Exactly. Before we let you go for the week. Let's just do our calls to action. We'll try and be quick. We probably won't though. We'll try


Ryan Boelter  1:52:50  

to be brief. That's fine. First, and don't forget to submit your question to our q&a. This is the last call for questions. I will be recording this very soon. You can get those in at questions dot character creation


Amelia Antrim  1:53:05  

If you are desperate to hear more from us, please consider backing the One Shot network slash one shot podcast, you get access to the secret archive, which has several episodes from us. I'm not going to try and count how many and a bunch of other shows on the network. You can watch that seed if you loved our Marvel episodes and want to hear our souls shatter just


Unknown Speaker  1:53:30  

a little. It's fine. Yeah. I don't know what to


Amelia Antrim  1:53:35  

do. Exactly.


Ryan Boelter  1:53:37  

Also, also coming up on Monday, May 16 is miracle Monday. This is an event that Jeff Stormer is going to be doing some superhero themed stream up on the One Shot network Twitch channel. So we teamed up with Jeff and John from system mastery to record an actual actual play. That would be part of this stream using the characters we created with the Marvel Superheroes series back in series 49. Please


Amelia Antrim  1:54:15  

know that we're not gonna replay. I just want to put that out there. So if anybody's like, oh, I don't really want that. Like, yeah, we're recreating them in sentinels, which we also recorded with Jeff and John. So I promise it'll be at least moderately listenable?


Ryan Boelter  1:54:30  

So, yeah, so it'll, it'll be fine. And you know, we're still sticking to it. We created these characters in Marvel Superheroes are still not playing the Marvel superhero version. These characters.


Amelia Antrim  1:54:45  

It's true. We're we're squeaking by on this technicality. These are not the characters we created. Like, Port them over word for word as much as we could. I mean, yes, pretty close. Um, Like I technically have more superpowers than I did, because I broke them down into parts. Sentinels wants you to be competent. So it's semantically the same types of powers. But it's not, it's not the same, it's not the same.


Ryan Boelter  1:55:15  

I probably got the most complex sentinels character in all of history, that probably breaks many of the rules of the game, just just to get 10 powers, or a changeling with five forms, but it's fine. It's fine. Either way, this stream will feature a lot of great superhero content, and all in the name of giving donations to the trans lifeline charity, which is definitely needed in this day and age more than ever. Absolutely. So please tune in to that. It's just two weeks away from today. And try to give a little bit to a really great cause, as well as be entertained for a


Amelia Antrim  1:55:59  

while. Yeah, yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited to see where this game goes, because we haven't recorded it yet. But then also, what everybody else brings to this because it's a it's a lot of cool people doing cool stuff. So absolutely. Still no reviews. So please, please, please, please, please, we are literally begging you please leave us reviews. You can leave them on Apple podcasts pod chaser or podcast addict and Facebook. You could also join our Discord at discord dot character creation and just tell us how great we are to our face. Yeah, that one doesn't help us as much but you know, it makes us feel good. I'll still take it. Say it to my face.


Ryan Boelter  1:56:46  

I don't think threatening,


Amelia Antrim  1:56:49  

threatening audience here and say it to my face. telling me how great I am.


Ryan Boelter  1:56:56  

Do it now. Please. Well, that's it for our calls to action. Thanks so much for sticking with us everyone. Next week, we will be finishing their characters. Just definitely a whole thing that happened. Until then, have a good rest of your week. Stay safe, drink some water, loosen your shoulders, unclench your jaw, maybe wearing a mask. Vaccinate and keep making those amazing people. We'll see you next time.


Amelia Antrim  1:57:48  

Thank you for joining us for part one of this character creation series. We'll be back in part two picking up right where we left off.


Ryan Boelter  1:57:54  

Character Creation Cast is a production of the One Shot Podcast Network and can be found online at www dot character creation had to the website to get more information on our hosts this show and even our press kit. Character Creation Cast can also be found on twitter at creation cast or ON OUR DISCORD SERVER at discord dot character creation I one of your hosts Ryan boelter and I can be found on twitter at Learn Neptune or online at Lord Our other host Amelia Antrim can be found on twitter at ginger reckoning. Music for this episode is used with a Creative Commons license, or with permission from the podcast they originated from. Further information can be found within the show notes. Our main theme music is hero remixed by Steve combs. And it's used with a Creative Commons license. This podcast is owned by us under Creative Commons. This episode was edited by Ryan boelter. Further information for the game systems used and today's guests can be found in the show notes. If you'd like to leave us a rating or review. We have links to various review platforms out there including Apple podcasts in our show notes. Also, check the show notes for links to our other projects. Thanks for joining us. I remember we find that the best part of any role playing game is character creation. So go out there and create some amazing people. We will see you next time.


Amelia Antrim  1:59:41  

Now we got to read some show blurbs show blurbs show show birth show blurbs. Character Creation Cast is hosted by the One Shot Podcast Network. If you enjoyed our show, visit one shot where you'll find other great shows like Neo scam


Ryan Boelter  1:59:58  

news GM is in narrative comedy podcast featuring five Chicago improvisers antagonizing their way through the role playing classic Shadowrun. It follows a group of misfits and outsiders z the acerbic cyber troublemaker, pox the candy junkie klepto from across the pond tech wizard, the Public Access actor with a petulant thirst for adventure. And Dec Rambo the nastiest trucker this side of the road will Mason Dixon join the arrestable Neo scum crew on a pure aisle rockin road trip through a weirdo World of Tomorrow, doling out street justice to every deep they encounter. Whether they deserve it or not.


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